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  • Topic

    Crossover Chat 289

    Comment
    This is not just another chat room. We are here to improve our language skills, German or English, and to encourage a spirit of community. All who share these aims are welcome.

    In the immortal words of our founder, odondon irl: «ein Faden, in dem Deutschsprechende auf Englisch und Englischsprechende auf Deutsch schreiben können, um zu üben, um Korrekturen zu ergattern, um des Spaßes Willen.»

    We come from here: Crossover Chat 288
    related discussion: Crossover Chat 288 - #262

    Snails that appeared in CC 288 (in order of tentaculation):
    hm -- us, Wachtelkönig, Carullus, Steve53, Robert -- US, Thusnelda, harambee, Dixie, Goldammer, Gibson, Amy-MiMi, fettucini, Emil 14, Lara Chu (AmE), Abertawe, wi-chan, leo029, estrellita, thing one, suziq, He-le-na, penguin, bluesky, Wolfman, and Sachs


    Topics we talked about in CC288


    Plants, animals and other organisms
    Bienen, Murmeltier, raps(canola), almond trees, Tauben, Meisen, Schwertlilien, Robinia pseudoacacia, Grasshopper, Muskelkater, the virus, quail, Zimtschnecken, eine Maus, zwei Strumpfbandnattern, drei Streifenhörnchen, Eichhörnchen, Wanderdrosseln, einige Zecken, Ameisen,
    "No, in Norway you don't need a vaccination" [They have so much Vaccinium growing there.], Ixodes scapularis, Dermacentor variabilis, Borrelia burgdorferi, blackcap, sparrow, Birken, Varroa-Milbe, Moskitos, Pigs, Pferd.


    Useful tools, gadgets and devices
    Fußball, basic cable, ein langes Polster, Gartenhacke, a bucket of water, iPhone, ein neues Auto, Digitalkabelfernsehen, Kühlschrank, Testament, a frying pan, oven, more than 4.2 million surveillance cameras, tons of make-up, school uniforms, credit cards, Calvin Klein boxers, iPod, the internet, Duden, prepaid card, "The Thermomix is a true "Eierlegende Wollmilchsau"." Kaffeemaschine und Trinkwassersprudler, Briefpapier, Füllfeder, Füller, Federhalter, Füllfederhalter, Füllhalter, fountain pen, inkwell, Broomstick, gel pens ganz vorne, Notausstiegsluke, flying carpet, magic lamp, Playstation, eine tolle Eselsbrücke!

    Culture, family and social life
    Väter, Schlaganfall, 'Es geht uns gut', "Der Prophet gilt nichts im eigenen Land", Gordon Lightfoot, Neil Diamond, Jethro Tull, Meat Loaf, teen moms, Stress, 'payday lenders', Wettannahmen, ins Staatssäckel, er und seine Kumpane,
    *wink* :-) ;-) *waves* ;-))))) SCNR Hmpf :-D
    *wavingateverybody* :o)
    Worries, Teatro Argentino, Joe und Josephine Sixpack, Otto Normalverbraucher and Lieschen Müller, Strassenfest, Herbert Grönemeyer, "ein tolles Lächeln und schöne blaue Augen", "typical day in my life", ein seltener Besuch, Oma!!!, Briefwechsel mit einer Partnerklasse, Intercourse,
    "Just imagine: I heard about someone whose cousin knows somebody whose aunt thinks differently!"
    *tief einatmen*, Falschwähler


    Places to leave, places to stay
    Mexico City, weit im Norden, Michigan, Chile, hügelige Landschaft, Midwest, countryside, Iowa, North-Rhine-Whestfalia, Rhineland,
    Milwaukee, Wisconsin, Michigansee, Ostsee, Litauen, Klaipeda, Maisfelder, California, Natural History Museum, Madame Tussaud's London, Gemüsegarten, Baltimore, Delaware, Spain, New Jersey, WG, India or South America, Omaha, Burlington County, Ventnor City, Atlantic City, UK, London, New York, England, Kenia, Colombia, Berlin, the beach, im Garten, Norway, Bielefeld, "Pergola", France, Thailand, South Carolina, American airports, Württemberg, Bochum, Franfurt/Main, Willi-Brandt-Platz, West Virginia, Kenya, Bonn, Lovely place, neck of the woods, the Rhine valley, Birkenwerder, Indiana, Austria, Switzerland, Gemüsebeete, California, not Florida, Australien, Irland,


    Food and beverages
    Honey, frische Erdbeeren, cream, Zucker/Süßstoff, kein Obst, Wassermelonen, wilde Brombeere, Pfirsich, blueberries, cherries, Chips, Avocadocreme, Grapefruits, Meat Loaf, drugs and alcohol, passion fruit juice, delicate vegetable stew, cured pork, halal, pea soup, Speck oder Schinken, "Maracujasaft", apple, orange and multivitamin juice, cocktails, with vodka, grapefruit juice, Paw paw with lime, pineapple, bananas, cereals, Tea, coffee, Zimtschnecken, die erste Erdbeere, Kohlrabi, fresh rolls, asparagus, veggie soup, purple(!) basil, creamy soups, ice cream, apples for my muesli, Peter Piper's pickled pointed peppers, Giersch, Sauerampfersalat, Lavender, Spinach, coke & heroburgers, Käse, Wurst und Schoki, Pfefferminz, chocolate biscuit, Traube, Kirsche, eine Tomate! Bruschetta, gazpacho!

    Very hot topics
    Special and typical days.
    Soccer, Söckchen, football & footie.

    Keep on sliming ...
    (and don't forget: "Hier sind die Teilnehmer immer höflich.")


    AuthorEmil 14 (299747) 12 Jun 12, 17:34
    Comment
    Wie, ihr habt Emil so ungeduldig um den neuen Faden gebeten und jetzt schreibt keiner darin? Oder lesen wir allen nur immer noch nach? (-:

    Danke, Emil, sehr schön kategorisiert. Der Essen- und Getränkteil allein dürfte jede Menge Mitlesende anlocken.
    #1Authorhm -- us (236141) 12 Jun 12, 18:00
    Comment
    Wow, Emil, thank you very much!
    This reminds me of "Kunst aufräumen", does anyone know that? It's little books in which a Swiss(?) on the one page shows a classic picture, on the other side, he 'sorted' all things of the picture in categories (colour, size, etc.) Really nice!

    Edith found a link: http://www.kunstaufraeumen.ch/de/die-buecher
    #2Authorestrellita (236267) 12 Jun 12, 18:15
    Comment
    Thanks for the great new home, Emil! Amazing that so many topics were covered in the old one. I definitely have to reread it :-)
    #3Authorharambee (91833) 12 Jun 12, 18:48
    Comment
    WOW, Emil you did a great job. Thank you.

    Nothing happened today in the hospital.
    Now we had dinner, German style, "Stulle mit Brot".
    A little bit TV, a little bit PC and then it is "Zapfenstreich"
    #4AuthorSteve53 (329426) 12 Jun 12, 19:15
    Comment
    Sehr schön gemacht, Emil, danke.

    Die Hochlichter erinnern mich daran, dass ich etwas über "footie" sagen (schreiben) wollte. "Footies" sind auch diese Schlafanzüge mit angesetzten Füßlingen (auch "Schlafoverall" genannt).
    #5AuthorRobert -- US (328606) 12 Jun 12, 19:36
    Comment
    Emil, thank you very much for a great summary. I really have to contribute more regularly. Just don't expect me to talk about either soccer or footies ;-)
    #6Authorpenguin (236245) 12 Jun 12, 19:36
    Comment
    Stimmt, Robert. Daran denke ich auch, wenn ich "footie(s)" höre.

    Danke fürs Basteln, Emil! Unglaublich, was wir alles in einem Faden besprechen...
    #7AuthorLara Chu (AmE) (236716) 12 Jun 12, 20:02
    Comment
    Thanks Emil!
    Great idea, sorting the contents of a thread in categories!
    #8AuthorGoldammer (428405) 12 Jun 12, 20:27
    Comment
    @ estrellita #2:
    I seem to remember having read the words "Kunst aufräumen" somewhere before, but I didn't remember having seen any of the pictures on the first page of your link. However, I went through the pictures available on the web, and the noodles orderly arranged on a plate rang a bell, and the cars in a car park re-arranged and sorted by colour seemed faintly familiar. There also seem to be some videos on the web - maybe, I will have a look at them later.

    edit: "erschienen bei Kein & Aber" - yet another trace ...
    #9AuthorEmil 14 (299747) 12 Jun 12, 21:33
    Comment
    "Aufräumen" that is a poke in a wasp nest to me.
    I am certain, that during the night, little green men throw all my tools around and make a mess out of my shop.
    But my dainty dear wife always forces me to clean up, or else.....
    #10AuthorSteve53 (329426) 13 Jun 12, 05:38
    Comment
    Thanks, Emil. Are you sure you read only one thread for this huge amount of contents?

    @ penguin:

    Be welcome, without soccers and footies. There's only one thing you might hear from me about soccers, and that's a complaint about the present TV programme. Is there anyone who can explain why it isn't enough when several sports channels show all the games but they have to run simultanously on half of the regular channels too? Yes, ok, I know, the answer is: Viewing rate. But times like this are absolutely horrible for all the folks who aren't soccers fans (could say the same about tennis, formel 1, skiing ... at other times). I wish there were at least half as many channels with culture (theatre, opera, valuable movies). Since the "Tatort"'s that are shown in several channels as an alternative programme aren't that satisfying either.

    Ok, back to work, not more satisfying either, but necessary.
    #11AuthorSachs (638558) 13 Jun 12, 10:15
    Comment
    Filmtipp:
    Heute um 20:15 läuft auf Arte der sehenswerte Film "Schmetterling nd Taucherglocke" (Le scaphandre et le papillon bzw. The Diving Bell and the Butterfly).
    #12Authorpenguin (236245) 13 Jun 12, 12:35
    Comment
    Thanks for reminding me, penguin. I saw it in a programme magazine already last week but almost forgot it again. I read the book long time ago, so I'm curious for the film.
    #13AuthorSachs (638558) 13 Jun 12, 13:22
    Comment
    Danke, Emil! Die Hochlichter sind Spitze!

    Und von estrellita habe ich von Kunstaufräumen gelernt. Genial! Ich habe ein Buch "durchblättert" und zum ersten Mal, so fern ich mich erinnern kann, von Malevich gehört. Der Holzfäller gefällt mir besser unaufgeräumt. Sein Gemälde "The Knifegrinder" ist auch toll.

    Korrektürchen für Sachs: I read the book a long time ago, so I'm curious about (looking forward to?) the film.

    Korrektürchen für Steve: A little bit of TV, a little (bit) PC and then it is "Zapfenstreich".

    @Steve: bloody hört sich nicht gut an. Hoffentlich erfährst du was Positives.

    @Sachs: soccer (Einzahl) genügt schon

    @Dixie: Ja, ich weiß, dass footie = Fußball, war nur ein lahmer Witz.
    #14AuthorAmy-MiMi (236989) 13 Jun 12, 17:00
    Comment
    Auch ein Tipp von mir für die Linksteichler: Heute Abend um 21 Uhr läuft auf einem PBS-Sender in meiner Gegend 'Birdsong'. Es soll eine recht gelungene Adaptation sein. Ich hab's bei der Erstausstrahlung verpasst. (Ich weiß, dass der Ausstrahlungspläne (TV schedules?) vieler PBS-Sender nicht gleich sind, aber ich dachte, ich mache euch darauf aufmerksam. Falls ihr auch Interesse daran habt, solltet ihr nachschauen, ob es auch demnächst bei euch läuft.)

    #15AuthorLara Chu (AmE) (236716) 13 Jun 12, 17:02
    Comment
    Hi Amy, yes, I also think the idea is awesome! Isn't there one from Van Gogh, and in the "tidied up" version, everything just went under the bed? Loved it when I first saw it.

    And if some of you leftpondians would like to listen to German radio covering the match tonight, rbb Inforadio broadcasts live: http://www.inforadio.de/dossier/fussball_em_2... They broadcast all matches of the German team in full length, plus all matches from the quarter finals on.
    #16Authorestrellita (236267) 13 Jun 12, 17:45
    Comment
    >>'Birdsong'. Es soll eine recht gelungene Adaptation sein

    Ist es tatsächlich, kann ich auch empfehlen. Und es hat auch eine schöne *6g* Augensüßigkeit. (-;

    Ich hoffe auch, dass es Steve gut geht. Hoffentlich sind auch die unangenehmen Optionen wenigstens durchstehbar, bzw. auf kurze Sicht durchsitz- und -liegbar. Häng in dort (©Amy)!

    Yipi, ich habe gerade den Piano Puzzler erraten. Doch einen guten Tag. (-:
    #17Authorhm -- us (236141) 13 Jun 12, 21:22
    Comment
    Ja, hm! Sogar 2x Augensüßigkeit, LOL! Ich bin großer Fan von Eddie Redmayne UND Richard Madden :o) Ich freue mich schon drauf!
    #18AuthorLara Chu (AmE) (236716) 13 Jun 12, 21:34
    Comment
    slightly OT @hm -- us: Some people are just more argumentative than others. Don't let it make you turn to horoscopes ....

    Eddie Redmayne and Richard Madden are both way too young!
    #19Authorpenguin (236245) 13 Jun 12, 21:46
    Comment
    Nicht für mich... ;o) Eddie Redmayne ist sogar ein Jahr älter als ich!
    #20AuthorLara Chu (AmE) (236716) 13 Jun 12, 21:47
    Comment
    Welcher ist denn welcher? Ich habe nicht mal von dem einen oder dem anderen gehört, und wer auch immer den Blonden in Birdsong gespielt hat, war mir neu. (Hmm, weil ich nicht so viele Filme wie Lara gucke, oder weil ich nicht jung genug bin? Nicht antworten bitte ...) Normalerweise kann ich künstliche Lippenvergrößerung ja nicht gutheißen, aber wenn nicht mal das den allgemeinen Eindruck stört ... *g*

    Hi, pengu. Na, streitsüchtig bin ich manchmal selber (wenn ich Recht habe, natürlich *unschuldigguck*), aber wenn auch vernünftige Leoniden gegen mich sind, sollte das mir vielleicht durchaus zu denken geben. Das ist es wohl, was mich eigentlich mehr irritiert, als der Streit an sich. *seufz* Aber damit kann ich auch leben.

    Gut immerhin zu wissen, dass nicht nur auf mich herumgehackt wird und gewisse lästige PMs auch von anderen einfach ignoriert werden. (-;

    #21Authorhm -- us (236141) 13 Jun 12, 22:12
    Comment
    Welcher vernünftige LEOnide ist denn gegen Dich, hm -- us? (psst: auf mir rumgehackt)
    #22Authorpenguin (236245) 13 Jun 12, 22:17
    Comment
    Na, heute anscheinend jede Menge, die alle 'list of food' statt 'list of foods' sagen würden: related discussion: list of the foods (served at a party)

    Aber das ist ja nicht schlimm, wie gesagt lässt es mich (mir?) nur ein bisschen am eigenen Sprachgefühl zweifeln. Was natürlich auch nicht schlimm ist. (-:

    Danke für die Korrektur. Ich schlage auf ihn, ich haue auf ihn, aber ich hacke auf ihm? Waruuum, wiesoooo ... Speaking of doubting my own sanity.
    #23Authorhm -- us (236141) 13 Jun 12, 22:32
    Comment
    hm, it's even more complicated:

    Ich hacke auf ihn ein but Ich hacke auf ihm 'rum.

    It's the 'rum that changes it, normally you're right, it should be accusative.


    Thank you, Emil, for the great new thread. I need to adopt this one, so just sliming through.

    (But, even though I don't know either of the actors, there's no such thing as 'too young' as long as we're talking legal age ;)
    #24AuthorGibson (418762) 13 Jun 12, 22:37
    Comment
    Aber das ist ja nicht schlimm, wie gesagt lässt es mich (mir?) nur ein bisschen am eigenen Sprachgefühl zweifeln. Was natürlich auch nicht schlimm ist. (-:

    Passiert mir auch öfters.. deswegen nehme ich nur ganz selten an Diskussionen teil. Laut dem, was ich hier manchmal im Forum lese, ist mein Englisch sub-sub-substandard, ;o)

    Edit: Achja--Eddie Redmayne spielt in der Hauptrolle bei "Birdsong" (seine Lippen sind schon etwas groß... ich kenne ihn eigentlich als Angel Clare in der BBC Verfilmung von Tess, die letztens auch auf PBS zu sehen war.)
    #25AuthorLara Chu (AmE) (236716) 13 Jun 12, 22:41
    Comment
    Dafür ist dein Deutsch ganz toll :)
    (Aber nur, wenn du nicht 'öfters' sagst - das ist zwar wunderbar idiomatisch, aber eigentlich falsch und eines meiner pet hates))
    #26AuthorGibson (418762) 13 Jun 12, 23:44
    Comment
    Good evening everyone,
    today I took the remaining parts of the CAE exam - Reading, Writing, Use of English and Listening - with ease; I finished 15 minutes early in the first three parts!
    However, I know of two mistakes and my writing wasn't the best.
    Won't be a problem though.

    Now I want to share and comment on the latest developments (focussing on the UK) with you.

    Studies have revealed that the count of pupils taking a GCSE (General Certificate of Secondary Education) in a foreign language has reached an all-time low.
    The reason for this is that in 2004, the government ended compulsory foreign language classes for children above the age of 14.
    Now, politicians consider a reform of the school system.
    Children will have to learn a foreign language by the age of seven and recite poems by the age of 5.
    http://www.metro.co.uk/news/901592-foreign-la...
    Both are rather ridiculous approaches to the difficulties the British education system is facing at the moment.
    It restricts primary school teachers even further and will cause high costs, as language teachers have first to be found and trained.
    Also, as there won't be a reform of the secondary school system, learning a foreign language like Mandarin in primary school will be completely in vain, because there won't be the possibility to continue the studies at high school.
    And why do 5-year-old children need to recite poems anyways?
    What's the point there?
    Teaching them how to read and spell fluently and correctly is of much greater importance, I think - perfect to get to the next point.
    http://www.metro.co.uk/news/newsfocus/901904-...
    Introducing the spelling bees to the UK has become an issue due to the proposals (see above) by politicians which also include a compulsory spelling list for 9-year-olds.
    However, I don't think that children "Ursprache" or "Stromuhr" correctly (here's a list of the words asked in the finals: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Scripps_...).
    Also, the winners in this competition are most probably children who have been pushed by their parents - it doesn't seem to be about fun, but about prestige.

    My 10-year-old boy still has to do spelling exercises at school. He's 10!
    At that age, I had already devoured several Harry Potter books!
    Something's going a very wrong way here in the UK...
    The Ofsted (Office for Standards in Education, Children's Services and Skills) agrees:
    http://www.metro.co.uk/news/901864-50-per-cen...
    The Ofsted basically conducts visits at several hundred schools in the country, giving them a rating to certify quality standards.
    As stated in the report, half the schools inspected did not match the requirements.
    The *6g* dark figure *6g* (correct translation, but different meaning/context!?), however, is probably much higher.
    Many schools have been reported to send problem students on trips or home for the duration of the visits.
    A good rating attracts new students and therefore also governmental fundings.


    As for the events in Syria, it feels like we're back in the Cold War - the USA accuses Russia of providing the regime with attack helicopters, while Russia states that the USA supplies rebel soldiers with weapons.
    Those are dark times.
    I have the slight feeling that something terrible will happen soon.

    (For those who are wondering why I read the METRO: My hostmother neither watches news on the TV, nor does she buy newspapers. That's why I am restricted to free newspapers.)
    #27AuthorThonatas (821337) 14 Jun 12, 00:30
    Comment
    Huch, ich wusste nicht, dass oefters falsch war. Ich werde versuchen, mich auf oefter umzustellen! :o)

    (Ich komme noch mal zurueck, um Thonatas' Riesenbeitrag zu lesen! :o))
    #28AuthorLara Chu (AmE) (236716) 14 Jun 12, 01:20
    Comment
    "öfters" is welcome with me, Lara Chu.
    Try replacing it with "immer wieder" if you want to mollify Gibson.
    I would not recommend using "öfter" in #25, and "des öfteren" sounds a little old-fashioned or even stilted.

    The lock/locked-out thread completely escaped my attention, hm -- us.
    300 postings within 50 hours!
    The appropriate song here is obviously:
    http://www.folkinfo.org/songs/displaysong.php...
    'Or in your own blood wallow' - gorgeous!

    Thank you for your detailed report from the British education system, Thonatas.
    Being not a teacher myself and, hence, not knowing what to expect of pupils of a specific age, I look forward to more educated opinions.
    I don't remember, so I can only guess that "Enid Blyton", "blanket" and "torch light" might have been the keywords characterizing my reading skills at the age of 10 or, maybe, 11 (or even 12?).

    #29AuthorEmil 14 (299747) 14 Jun 12, 02:48
    Comment
    Enid Blyton was not my case, I used to listen to the tape versions though.
    I preferred "TKKG" (the German equivalent of the Enid Blyton stories: four friends solving crimes) - I still have about 20 books stored away in my wardrobe.

    As I cannot edit my post above anymore, I have to write it here:
    The thing that made my day was the comment published in the London Evening Standard (another free newspaper; I usually read the METRO in the morning and the Standard in the evening).
    It was about the proposed introduction of more foreign languages to primary schools in earlier years, which I mentioned in my last post.

    "A heart-breaking holiday at the age of 13 (ah! Céline!) convinced me that paying attention in French might be worth it, pulling-wise, in a way that paying attention in maths might not. "

    It reminded me of the days when I started learning Italian.
    Another long story to tell here - but I think it's worth it.
    Reminiscing about lost love. :)
    When I entered the 7th year of school, I initially chose Latin as second foreign language.
    For half a year, I studied the basic grammar principles and soaked up the vocabulary like a sponge.
    However, I didn't feel well in my class; a lot of bullying was going on, a thing that had forced me to change school when I was in year 6.
    I eventually changed class in the middle of year 7, for which I had to learn and make up for half a year of French that my new class already had studied.
    I became one of the best pupils in French class, which urged my teacher to arrange a private exchange with a boy from Caen, France.
    After the exchange, I was totally crazy about languages.
    In year 8, I then took part in a school exchange with a little town in the North of Italy, despite my non-existent knowledge of the language.
    During my time there, I "fell in love" with one of the girls from my class who were participating in the exchange.
    Me, a naive, pubescent little idiot! :P
    It actually made me start learning Italian voluntarily at school, a thing which I kept doing for two years even though the girl had moved abroad right after the exchange.

    Ah! Constanze!

    That doesn't sound as smooth as Céline.
    My apologies.

    So far, I have taken part in three school exchanges with Italy and seven or eight with the "Caenien".


    Edit: I just saw that I missed out some words in my last post:
    However, I don't think that children should ever have to be able to spell "Ursprache" or "Stromuhr" correctly
    #30AuthorThonatas (821337) 14 Jun 12, 04:00
    Comment
    Ich schon, wieso denn nicht? Uhrsprache wäre ja wohl was anderes ...

    Nein, im Ernst, das ist beeindruckend, Thonatas, so jung und schon wie viele Fremdsprachen, 3, 4? Hut ab. Du bist nicht etwa Schweizer und hast daher einen gewissen Vorteil? Aber auch wenn.

    Jetzt brauchst du anscheinend nur eine nette Engländerin kennenzulernen. Oder was würde passieren, wenn du eine nette Finnin, Ungarin, Baskin treffen würdest? Chinesisch, Arabisch könnte auch Spaß machen ... Und dann könntest du Gedichte auswendig lernen und Grundschullehrer in England werden. (-;

    >>pulling-wise
    Ist 'pulling' vielleicht britisches Slang für pauken oder so was?
    #31Authorhm -- us (236141) 14 Jun 12, 04:38
    Comment
    hm -- us, to pull a chick = ein Mädel aufreißen; there is also a "chick-puller", a car which makes it easier to pull a chick (yes, BE).

    And though I am not a native, I would also speak of a "list of foods", maybe that makes you feel a bit better.
    #32Authorpenguin (236245) 14 Jun 12, 07:29
    Comment
    @ Lara:

    Actually "öfters" isn't wrong, even the Duden knows it:
    öfters (landsch. für öfter)
    According to this there might be regional differencies in the use (or nonuse) of it, but I'm afraid Gibson has to overthink one of her pet hates.

    @ Thomatas:

    Your "My 10-year-old boy .... He's 10!" gave me a smile when I read it last night. Latter was really what I expected after the beginning of the sentence before ;-)

    I'm not a teacher either. My only thought about this matter is, that it is never too early to start learning a language. And even if there are problems in the continuity of education it's maybe of an advantage to have at least basic knowledge about a language. So if there has to be a decision for or against a certain lanuage later on that might already help. And the earlier they start the better.

    I haven't read the articles, but what makes you think the idea is to teach them some exotic language like Mandarin? And even if so. Why not? Even to know some words and phrases you will be taught at an age of 6 or 7 might arouse some interest that could be beneficial later on.

    That well-educated teachers are necessary is out of question. I don't know how the situation in the UK is, but if they have as many unemployed teachers as there are elsewhere it would be a good solution to employ some of them who are willing to take some extra classes themselves to prepare for basic language courses. Even an exchange of teachers between different countries for native speakers education would be thinkable.

    But as I said, I haven't read the articles and don't know anything about the plans of the gouvernment.

    About learning poems at an age of 5:
    Why not? The kids are certainly not expected to learn the English equivalent of "Die Bürgschaft" or "Die Glocke" but will probably have to start with simple four-liners, nursery rhymes, whatsoever.

    @ Amy:

    Thank you for the 'türchen. I couldn't decide between "for" and "about", first had "for", changed it then to "about" but finally rechanged it again ....

    Besides it really was more curiosity than anticipation. I'm always a bit suspicious when films are made after books I've read already. It happens too often that the book was much better. It only happened once the other way round: This only excpetion I can remember was "Scent of a woman". When I decided to buy the book after seeing the film I was absolutely disappointed. How can they sell a book as "book to the film" with an completely different story and just a few photos from the film in it? The only thing the two stories had in common was, that they both were about some blind fellow.

    In this case the film was really impressive.
    #33AuthorSachs (638558) 14 Jun 12, 08:59
    Comment
    Gibt es nicht Fäden an Rechtschreibwettbewerben? Amerikaner machen das halt gern. Da Englisch so viele Lehnwörter hat und die Rechtschreibung und Aussprache Wörter auch muttersprachlicher Herkunft auch Probleme darstellt, ist es nicht selbstverständlich, dass ein zehnjähriger Schüler vernünftig schreiben kann. Auch für ältere Schüler ist das ein Problem. Ohne die eigenen Fähigkeiten aufzubauen, nimmt man jeden Schrott an, den der Rechtschreibprüfer anbietet.

    Die Schüler, die an Scripps-Howard teilnehmen, machen das größtenteils, weil es ihnen Spaß macht. Die meisten Schüler, die das widerwillig machen, schaffen es nicht so weit. Und wenn manche mitmachen, nur weil sie ein Stipendium gewinnen wollen, finde ich das nicht schlecht. In den USA werden Schüler die Sport treiben gefeiert und gerühmt, was schadet es wenn mal ein Schüler, der gern liest und Wörter lernt, Beifall erregt?

    Hier ein Artikel über eine Schülerin aus Jamaika, die 1998 gewonnen hat.

    http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m1077/i...

    "When Jody-Anne Maxwell returned to her native Jamaica after becoming the first Black winner of the National Spelling Bee in Washington, D.C., she received the kind of welcome reserved for soccer stars and reggae singers. Since that time, she has become a symbol of what can be accomplished with a little hard work and a lot of determination."

    Und hier erfährt man, dass sie ursprünglich nicht mitmachen wollte, aber aus einer Pflicht wurde eine Freude und am Buchstabierwettbewerb fand sie dann Vergnügen. "As 'head girl' of her class at Ardenne High School in St. Andrew, Maxwell wasn't enthusiastic when told her duties included participating in the spelling bee. The headmistress didn't give her much choice: If she refused, she would be stripped of her 'head girl' status, Maxwell reluctantly obliged and, much to her own surprise, rose to the occasion. 'When Jody-Anne started to spell, she developed a love for words,' says her father, Lloyd Maxwell."

    Gerade der Frackvogel informiert uns zu "pull a chick". Finde ich angebracht! Ich lerne so viele BE Wörter. Neulich war es "thuddering".

    Emils Satz Try replacing it with "immer wieder" if you want to mollify Gibson. küre ich zu Satz des Zimmers. Irgendwie gefällt er mir besonders, auch wenn ich nicht unbedingt die Besänftigung (mollification!) von Gibson befürworten. *freundlich lächel* Nichts für ungut, Gibson. *gg*
    #34AuthorAmy-MiMi (236989) 14 Jun 12, 14:35
    Comment
    Hmmm... somebody wants me to throw another tantrum... But I'm older and wiser now and much more Zen. It's not going to happen *smilingbeatifically*

    What's 'landsch(aftlich).', Sachs? As in (landsch. für öfter).
    So it's in the Duden now, is it? Well, the Duden is descriptive so it's only ever a matter of time until the wrong things become the right things, which is fine - language is alive and changes. But I'm old enough to grumble about the silly modern nonsense now and start sentences with "When I was at school...," so I'll stick to my old-fashioned idea of right, if that's all right with you ;)

    My 10-year-old boy still has to do spelling exercises at school. He's 10!
    At that age, I had already devoured several Harry Potter books!

    Those two things have nothing to do with each other, Thonatas. Your reading can be brilliant but your spelling terrible. English spelling is not easy, so it makes sense to practice a lot. It doesn't mean you can't read well.
    #35AuthorGibson (418762) 14 Jun 12, 15:31
    Comment
    Probably every snail knows
    Gerard Nolst Trenité – The Chaos (1922)
    http://blog.textlation.de/2010/10/englische-a...

    And searched and found again especially for Gibson:

    ...
    I suppose earlier generations had to sit through all this huffing and puffing with the invention of television, the phone, cinema, radio, the car, the bicycle, printing, the wheel and so on, but you would think we would learn the way these things work, which is this:

    1) everything that’s already in the world when you’re born is just normal;

    2) anything that gets invented between then and before you turn thirty is incredibly exciting and creative and with any luck you can make a career out of it;

    3) anything that gets invented after you’re thirty is against the natural order of things and the beginning of the end of civilisation as we know it until it’s been around for about ten years when it gradually turns out to be alright really.

    Apply this list to movies, rock music, word processors and mobile phones to work out how old you are.

    ...

    http://www.douglasadams.com/dna/19990901-00-a.html

    It probably also applies here! :-)
    #36AuthorHe-le-na (743297) 14 Jun 12, 15:55
    Comment
    Exactly what I was trying to say :)
    #37AuthorGibson (418762) 14 Jun 12, 16:03
    Comment
    *Korrektürchen verteil*

    Sachs(#28):
    -[Being not] Not being a teacher myself...

    Thonatas(#29):
    -However, I didn't feel [well] comfortable in my class; 'didn't feel well' could be misunderstood as meaning that you felt ill in that class

    Sachs(#33):
    -but I'm afraid Gibson has to [overthink] rethink/reconsider one of her pet hates
    -The latter was really what I expected after the beginning of the previous sentence [before]
    -go[u]vernment
    -How can they sell a book as "book to the film" with a[n] completely different story

    Meine Motivation heute ist gleich null. Roboter, Förderbänder, und Logistik im Allgemeinen habe ich satt. Ich bin mental (geistig?) so platt, dass ich nicht mal weiß, was ich euch sonst noch schreiben könnte.
    #38AuthorLara Chu (AmE) (236716) 14 Jun 12, 16:06
    Comment
    Oh, Lara's correction for Sachs reminded me that I wanted to comment but forgot:

    I think this (selling a book as film tie-in) happens every time the film is based on an orignal book (and not a film script). Sometimes it's close but sometimes the film just takes the basic idea and is totally different ('The Birds' and 'Blade Runner' are two more examples; 'The Birds' is just a 10-page short story and ends before the film starts, basically). But because it is the seed for the film, it's marketed accordingly. I've had a few of those cases, but mostly I liked the books anyway, I just have to let go of the film in my head.
    On the whole, I find it much more annoying the other way round: when books are written after the film's been made, what they call novelisation, I think, because they are often very badly written. So you think you're buying a great book because you really loved the film and then it turns out to be just a marketing thing.

    #39AuthorGibson (418762) 14 Jun 12, 16:18
    Comment
    Selbstkorrektur: befürworte.

    *faul sei*

    *Gibson, Lara und He-le-na wink*
    #40AuthorAmy-MiMi (236989) 14 Jun 12, 17:01
    Comment
    Oh dear.. did I miss an entire thread? Has it been that long?
    I am currently so busy writing applications.
    But today for some reason I can't concentrate very well. Again and again I am stuck, trying to paraphrase what I want to say, wondering: what's a good German word for "approach". Some things just not only sound better in English, but to me also make more sense. "Vorgehensweise", "Betrachtungsweise", "Ansatz" etc don't feel right - or are just too long as in "Herangehensweise" *urgh*.

    Re: spelling tests
    I always thought that spelling tests are the equivalent of the "Diktate" I had to write in school. And I remember still writing "Diktate" in 7th grade in German and up to 9th grade in English (and up to 10th grade in French - which was horrible).

    And I do believe they make sense. Epsecially when I was teaching German it was shocking (because incomprehensible) to read how some students spelled even well-known words. Imagine me writing English: Ei spell it leik ei hier it.
    Not kidding. Only since I don't speak Turkish or any Arabian language, I couldn't make sense of most of it, because I don't know how a "z" or "ç" is pronounced properly to relate it to a German sound.

    Speaking of teaching.. The other day had the weirdest conversation. I was home alone one morning when the door rang. I thought it was the postman, so I opened the door and was greeted by a chubby elderly man with heavy cross-eyes. He immediately started a monologue about this health charity he was collecting donations for etc etc and when he asked me for money and I kindly turned him down, he asked me what I do for a living. So I answered: "I teach German to immigrants." and he fell silent. He stared at me with his crossed eyes and then asked: "So, do you teach Arabs?" - I thought: What? ok.. I wonder where this conversation is going... and said: "Yes, I also teach Arabs." (long silent pause)
    The man was silent again, then, before I could ask him: "Why?" he just said in a low conspiratorial voice: "Ah. You need to be careful with that." then turned around and left as quickly as possible...

    If it hadn't been early morning and bright daylight, this encounter would have had Lynchian qualities it was so weird...


    #41AuthorJools (432226) 14 Jun 12, 17:06
    Comment
    Thanks for the first link in #36, He - le - na. I had heard about it, but had never seen the complete poem and I will have to listen to both versions. Why is the American speaker so much faster?

    #42Authorharambee (91833) 14 Jun 12, 17:14
    Comment
    Oh, a rare visitor! ;-) Hello Jools, that was indeed a weird encounter with that man. I wish you good luck with your applications. It's probably safe to assume that your are still not completely happy with the school you are working for at the moment?
    #43Authorharambee (91833) 14 Jun 12, 17:19
    Comment
    I think that regular reading is substantial for a good spelling - and much more important than studying the spelling of words that you will never get to hear or use in your life.

    Today, my English teacher told us that half the British students fail to pass their GCSE in English (at 16 years) - maybe that will bring some light into what I am saying.
    That means that my English is technically better - but not as fluent - as half the 16-year-old kids in this country and as good as the English of the other half, as I have passed all my Level 2 exams.

    You cannot just open another *6g* construction site *6g* if the work on the other one has not been done yet!

    And the idea of teaching British children Mandarin, Latin or Greek is simply grotesque.
    I was taught English during my primary school years, for example the "head, shoulders, knees and toes" song - but the selection of languages here in Britain is completely... weird.

    Of course, a primary school kid should know how to read a poem and understand the technique of rhyming.

    Here are some more figures and a much better article on this topic:

    "The latest Key Stage 2 results show that 33 per cent of 11-year-olds fail to achieve the expected standard in reading, writing and maths. That means 183,000 children left primary school without the required understanding of the three Rs last year."

    "Nearly 40,000 11-year-olds every year currently leave primary school with the reading ability of a seven-year-old."

    "The current National Curriculum expects pupils only to 'show understanding of place value up to 1,000'."


    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-21571...

    The intended math reform, however, is something I'd endorse.
    My boy cannot even count without having to use his fingers for the most simple substractions and additions - and he definitely doesn't have a learning disability or something like that.

    -----------------------------------

    @hm -- us: German, seven years of English (I don't count the primary school lessons; also, I didn't have any English class in the last two years of school), (Latin, half a year), French (seven years), Italian (two years) and Swedish.
    I started to learn the latter on my own in April, but at the moment, the motivation is rather non-existent.
    The cause for this flaw is actually a Swedish girl ;) - I learned too late that she has a boyfriend.
    However, Swedish is indeed a great language to learn and very easy, as it is a mixture between English and German.
    I intend to relaunch this project in a few days.
    I only have this one opportunity to talk with Swedish people, so I want to improve my speaking as far as possible before I leave in the end of July.

    -----------------------------------

    Another anecdote from my life:
    I was at the hairdresser's today.
    The woman hairdresser certified me a "weird posh British accent" :-)
    #44AuthorThonatas (821337) 14 Jun 12, 17:20
    Comment
    And the idea of teaching British children Mandarin, Latin or Greek is simply grotesque.

    Ähm, warum? Wer sollte denn diese Sprachen lernen? Und welche Sprachen sollten die kleinen Schotten und Engländer lernen? Hindi? Estnisch? Spanisch? Deutsch?

    *editier* Und die 40.000 Zahl sieht schlimm aus, aber wie viel sind das prozentual gesehen? Unter den 40.000 sind auch die Kinder, die mit 9. Jahren aus Afghanistan eingewandert sind, ohne ein Wort Englisch zu sprechen? Wenn schon, ist es gut verständlich, dass sie vielleicht nicht auf dem Niveau eines Muttersprachlers, der zusätzliche Jahren Unterrichts genossen hatte. Vielleicht sind auch die Schüler, die geistig zurückgeblieben sind, in der Zahl inbegriffen.

    Meiner Meinung nach ist Latein sehr nützlich, wenn man gut Englisch schreiben, sprechen und lesen will. Ich hätte gern Latein in der Schule gelernt, mir zur Auswahl stand nur Französisch und Deutsch. Warum sollten alle Kinder die gleiche Sprache lernen? Wenn manche auf irgendeinen Grund Mandarin lernen wollen, finde ich das gut. Je mehr Fremdsprachen, desto besser, meine ich.
    #45AuthorAmy-MiMi (236989) 14 Jun 12, 17:29
    Comment
    Why would you teach children a dead language (If I remember right, "Greek" refers to "Old/Ancient Greek") in primary school?
    Exotic languages like Mandarin should be part of the voluntary curriculum (in secondary school).
    I think they should just stick to the classic languages - Spanish and French.

    I have to admit that Latin is sometimes a "useful" language.
    And yes, children should be given the possibility to choose which languages they want to learn - but taking a decision already in primary school might be a bit early.

    Self-correction: ...is technically better than, but not as fluent as half...
    #46AuthorThonatas (821337) 14 Jun 12, 17:54
    Comment
    Selbstkorrektur: aus irgendeinem Grund...

    Zwar kenne ich mich nicht mit englischen Schulen aus, aber in dem von dir verlinkten Artikel steht, dass Kinder ab sieben Jahren eine Fremdsprache lernen müssen, nicht, dass sie eine bestimmte Sprache lernen müssen. Die Grundschulen dürfen Mandarin, Latein und Altgriechisch anbieten, zusammen mit Spanisch, Französisch und Deutsch. Ich nehme an, dass Schüler eine Sprache aussuchen dürfen. So stelle ich mir das vor. Ein Kind spricht zu Hause Spanisch und lernt Englisch in der Schule. Mit sieben Jahren darf das Kind entweder Spanisch oder sagen wir mal Mandarin als erste Fremdsprache wählen. Ich sehe da nichts drastisches. Wenn das Kind mit 11 Jahren plötzlich Lust hat Latein zu lernen, dürfte es vermutlich mit Latein anfangen und Mandarin abwählen. Ich glaube nicht, dass die englischen Kinder eine Fremdsprache mit sieben anfangen und dann für immer gezwungen werden, die Sprache weiter zu lernen. Ab einem bestimmten Jahr in der Schule dürfen die Schüler eine Sprache vermutlich nicht mehr abwählen, aber ich sehe die Reform so: die Behörden wollen den Kindern einfach mehr Möglichkeiten anbieten. Daran finde ich nichts schlechtes.

    Zu den GSCEs sagt Tante Wiki, dass die Hälfte der Schüler die 5 GSCEs mit einer Note von A* bis C bestehen. Das heißt, dass nur die Hälfte studieren dürfen, aber laut Tante Wiki sind die Noten von D bis G Noten, die als Level 2 gelten, immerhin "passing" Noten. Sagte dein Lehrer tatsächlich, dass nur die Hälfte eine Note von A*-G haben? Die anderen fallen durch?
    #47AuthorAmy-MiMi (236989) 14 Jun 12, 19:00
    Comment
    @ Gibson:

    I'm always a bit suprised about that "landschaftlich" too, because somehow it seems to be the wrong word here. It is used like "regional" or "reg." in other dictionaries for words that are only to find in parts of and not the complete German speaking world.

    @ Lara:

    Thanks for the corrections - just wrote down my thoughts very quickly without much proofreading in a short break during work, so I'm surprised there weren't more mistakes to find ;-)

    @ Thomatas:

    Why stick to the "classical" languages? There are too many people learning English, Spanish, Italian and French, and probably also German. If someone has a talent for languages and wants to make a career by working with languages the chances to find a job are much higher with some "exotic" language. But how should you know if you could like one of these languages if you never get the chance to hear / try it? And therefore this age seems to be absolutely the best time. I even guess some of the kids would find it "cool" to tell "I'm learning Mandarin now".

    And the so-called dead languages are the basic for quite a number of modern languages so it can be very helpful to learn Latin e.g. At least I always wished I had Latin lessons back in school. I see now the similarities in languages like French, Italian and Spanish, and I guess it would be much easier to learn these languages with Latin as a basic knowledge - even if almost no one really seems to love it at school.

    There's another thought that just crossed my mind: I guess it's no difference to other countries about having always pupils in the class whose mother tongue isn't English. I think it wouldn't be the worst idea to make the language of this/these pupil(s) an option to learn for their class mates.

    I see several benefits in this possibility:
    A social benefit for the whole class, because it gets easier to communicate.
    A certain "self learning effect", because if there is someone already speaking the language that is taught the learning process will be quickened because the kids certainly exchange more words out of the regular lessons than they usually would.
    An encouragement for the non native speakers to improve their English skills as well when there starts to be the possibility of a communication, even if it will be bilingual for quite a while.
    An increase in self-confidence for the pupils who don't speak English very well, when there finally is one lesson where they aren't the "stupid ones".

    I guess many parents will not agree with this idea, since they do not even like the idea that their children are educated with "these other children", nevertheless I think it would be a very interesting way to improve social life as well as language skills.
    #48AuthorSachs (638558) 14 Jun 12, 19:35
    Comment
    Sachs, mir gefällt deine Idee, dass Kinder von einander Sprachen lernen können. Als ich in der Schule war, hätte ich es geliebt, in einer zwei- oder mehrsprachigen Klasse zu sein, es wäre einfach interessanter gewesen.

    In einer der Zeitungen von heute gibt es einen Artikel über das FBI und wie sie gerade Sprachkundige (leider nur US-Bürger) suchen, nicht für Französisch oder Latein, sondern gerade für Arabisch, Mandarin und (uns) noch ungewöhnlichere Sprachen. Die Liste liest sich fast wie eine Karte der Weltkonfliktgegende: Farsi, Urdu, Dari, Paschto, Koreanisch, Hebräisch.

    Mir war nicht bewusst, dass Somali eine eigene Sprache ist, und was zum Kuckkuck ist Tigrinja (engl. Tigrinya)? Die Sprache der gestreiften Großkatzen etwa? (Huhu, tigger ...) Spanisch ist (wird?) immer noch gefragt, aber ansonsten kommt man mit den typischen 'alten' Schulfremdsprachen nicht weit.

    Wenn die Schüler und Studenten von heute ihrem Land nützlich sein wollen, sollen sie auch die Sprachen von heute lernen, und die Gesellschaft darf/soll ihnen das ermöglichen (? aaack), in dem die Schulen wenigstens so früh wie möglich mehr Schnuppermöglichkeiten anbieten. Ich finde ganz wie Amy, dass mehr Sprachkenntnisse im früheren Alter nicht schaden können, egal welcher Sprache(n). Das soll die Kenntnisse in der Muttersprache eigentlich nur verstärken; Amy oder Robert wird mehr darüber wissen, aber ich glaube, es gibt sogar Studien, die das bestätigen.

    Thonatas, da du gut in Fremdsprachen bist, könntest du dich vielleicht sogar bewusst für eine dieser selteneren Sprachen entscheiden und dann, wer weiß, sogar deiner Nation einen Gefallen tun und dich selbst einen guten Job versichern. Nur so als Idee, aber in deinem Alter ist noch vieles möglich. (-:

    Joo-hools, willkommen zurück und viel Glück weiterhin bei den Bewerbungen. Wie war denn Amsterdam, oder hast du schon davon berichtet und ich habe es vergessen/verpasst?

    He-le-na, das mit 'Was erst erfunden wird, nachdem man selber über 30 ist' stimmt wohl tatsächlich, auch wenn ich die Altersgrenze ein bisschen höher setzen würde, vielleicht 40 oder 45. Auf jeden Fall merke ich zunehmend, dass ich den Punkt in immer mehr Hinsichten schon wohl verpasst habe. *seufz*

    Gibson, danke für das *6g* Köpfe-hoch bzgl. 'öfters.' Auch wenn es nur einigen stört, ist das trotzdem nützlich zu wissen.

    Übrigens, falls Amerikaner oder Österreicher (insbesondere, aber auch andere) Gedanken zum Thema related discussion: stoop - offene Veranda haben, könnten wir noch ein paar Kommentare gebrauchen.
    #49Authorhm -- us (236141) 14 Jun 12, 20:35
    Comment
    Oh the orthography abilities of German pupils! GRRRR! The poor children in Germany learn to write in a very interesting way. The first two years in school they are allowed to write by "transcribing" what they hear. Parents are very energetically discouraged from correcting any mistakes because that would demotivate the children ("And we want them to write freely, don't we?!"). In the third year in school dictates start and the children are surprisingly bad at orthography. Why they are considered not to be frustrated by extremely bad marks in their third year is as yet unexplained.

    I am not sure whether the theory itself is dumb or whether the teachers I heard about have their own special interpretation of this theory. Germany is a federal republic and the school system has many variations but this "don't correct your children's orthography" in the first two years was reported by several parents I know from three different parts of Germany.

    Having forgotten my manners completey Edith advises me to try to patch this up nevertheless (better late than never!):
    Thank you Emil for the nice and very orderly new thread. It reminded me (as well as others) of this Swiss artist who tidies up works of art.


    *waving back at Amy - MiMi who did the first He-le-na waving ever on LEO*
    #50AuthorHe-le-na (743297) 15 Jun 12, 10:05
    Comment
    Tuuut tuut!

    Was ich nicht so ganz verstehe: ich finde, Lesen und Rechtschreibung sind eng mit einander verwandt. Wenn man liest, dann lernt man dabei, wie Wörter geschrieben werden. Das gilt mMn für jede Sprache, oder? Wenn ein deutsches Kind mit seinen Eltern Bücher liest, wird da kein orthografisches Basiswissen aufgebaut? Themen wie silent consonants, 'i before e except after c', ph = f, usw. werden sogar bei Sesamstraße behandelt.

    Nachdem wir letztens diesen Faden über *6g* Rechtschreibbienen *6g* hatten, frage ich mich ob die Betonung auf Rechtschreibung wirklich eine Eigenart der (amerikanischen?/englischsprachigen?) Kultur ist. Meine Mutter arbeitet seit 12 Jahre als Tagesmutter und hat meist 4-6 Schützlinge, von Säugling bis zum Kindergärtner. Mit 2 oder so fangen die Kinder an, viel zu Malen und meine Mutter bringt ihnen dann bei, wie jedes Kind seinen eigenen Namen schreibt. Und da die schon mit 2 oder 3 Sesamstraße oder Mr. Roger's Neighborhood gucken, fangen die recht früh an, einfache Wörter buchstabieren zu können. Meine Mutter unterstützt das: will das Kind sein Becher? Fragt meine Mutter: "How do you spell cup? How do you spell milk?" (Wenn's so weit ist, dass die Kinder das gut können, sind sie meist ungefähr 4 Jahre alt.) Ist sowas nicht normal? Oder ist meine Mutter eine 'Tiger'(tages)mutter? (Nur ein Scherz!)
    #51AuthorLara Chu (AmE) (236716) 15 Jun 12, 16:05
    Comment
    this "don't correct your children's orthography" in the first two years was reported by several parents I know from three different parts of Germany.

    We left Dresden when my daughter was halfway through her first year in elementary school. There, the pupils were expected to use only the words in writing that had been already introduced in class and of which they were supposed to know the spelling.
    The German school here follows the other approach of letting children write in the beginning as they hear the words.

    Well, I have always corrected my daughter and still do. I see it as a matter of style. I try not to convey the message "you made a mistake!" but rather "I offer you the opportunity to learn something!" Children are eager to learn.
    #52Authorafterhours (758017) 15 Jun 12, 16:12
    Comment
    When I was in school I was still told when my orthography was considered incorrect. (I still remember meaning "Herr" and writing "Heer" which made my teacher smile broadly.)

    I do not know when (and where) they changed the approach. And as I said I do not know the theory behind this.

    The current way of teaching to write (in some schools at least) appears to me to be nonsense. Not giving marks for orthography at the beginning seems ok, but not even correcting the faults and then suddenly (after two years) starting to give marks is just outright dumb.
    (But who am I to question professional pedagogues).

    As afterhours wrote - there are ways to correct the kids without demotivating them to write / from writing.
    #53AuthorHe-le-na (743297) 15 Jun 12, 16:37
    Comment
    I also believe it's closely connected to reading.
    My students don't read German. At least not outside the classroom.
    I remember having this discussion with them, about how strange they find it that almost everybody is always reading something when travelling with with S- or U-Bahn. Either a book or a newspaper etc... Or as one student put it: "Germans always read. We never read. It's just not something we do."
    (Which is ridiculous.. he was just lazy... and the same one who told me he's only attending class because otherwise his benefits will be cut and he has no real intention to learn German.)

    I actually had Latin in school from grade 7 to 11 and although I really really hated it and was anything but good at it, it has helped me a lot later with other European languages or just understanding foreign words. I would encourage my children to take it, although I fully support the argument it's much more useful to learn a language which is actually spoken.
    What I don't understand and support though is that you still have to have a "grosses Latinum" in order to study certain subjects at uni.
    A lot of my friends at uni had to take extra Latin classes and pass a very difficult Latin exam in order to continue their English or communication studies. This didn't make sense to me.


    @hm-us: Amsterdam wasnice, but very grey and cold and rainy. But we still borrowed bikes and had a great time. Especially the houseboat we stayed at was nice.
    #54AuthorJools (432226) 15 Jun 12, 16:48
    Comment
    AFAIK, the "Große Latinum" is nowadays only required for studying Ancient Languages and other Altertumswissenschaften and for Theology - those being subjects for which it makes sense imo.
    #55AuthorGoldammer (428405) 15 Jun 12, 16:53
    Comment
    Jools, for which subjects do you still need the "Großes Latinum"? Is there anything besides archeology, theology and history? I don't think it's necessary anymore for studying English?!

    Edit: I had not seen Goldammer's posting!
    #56Authorharambee (91833) 15 Jun 12, 16:56
    Comment
    Looks like they changed it then since I went to uni - which was pre-Bologna.
    Some of my friends studying "*insert any language* auf Lehramt" definitely had to do it, and of course Jura and Medizin and Politikwissenschaften.
    For Theologie and Geschichte you usually also needed ancient Greek, ie. "das Graecum".

    Edith wants to add Philosophie of course...for which you needed Latin.
    #57AuthorJools (432226) 15 Jun 12, 17:09
    Comment
    Lara, in England I knew several parents who used to spell words during conversation so that the little kids didn't understand them, so teaching them to spell as early as possible would have been counterproductive ;)

    I'm not sure I've made myself very clear, so here's an example:

    Mother to Gran: Do you think you'll take the kids to the P-L-A-Y-G-R-O-U-N-D later or do you think it'll rain?

    (Because if she said 'playground' the kids would start whining immediately that of course they want to got the playground, rain or no rain)

    I also knew at least one father who spelled his swearwords when the kids were young:
    - "There was this complete B-A-S-T-A-R-D cutting me up this morning!!"
    - "What's a bee-ay-thingy? What did daddy say?"
    - "He said he met a man this morning that wasn't very polite."

    One advantage of this is that at least the parents learn how to spell properly ;).


    I don't think there's anything wrong with learning an unusual language at school - nobody knows what's going to be needed in fifteen years' time anyway (do you remember all the yuppies hiring nannies to teach their toddlers Japanese in the eighties? That didn't turn out as planned), plus I generally don't like the idea of learning everything 'for a purpose'. There should be space at school to learn some things just because you want to.
    I am, however, doubtful if every student should have to learn two foreign languages at all. It'a bit like in the 'required reading' discussion a few CCs back about Shakespeare at school. I just think if somebody has no linguistic talent at all and maybe isn't that bright to boot, leave the poor kid alone. He or she is going to struggle enough with (in Germany) English as their first foreign language. Why torture them with a second one?
    #58AuthorGibson (418762) 15 Jun 12, 17:17
    Comment
    Jetzt wo du das erwähnst, machen die Eltern so was in den USA auch. Aber ich denke, solche Wörter sind dann immer noch zu schwierig für ein Kind. Selbst ein Kind, das "cup," "cat," "dog," usw. buchstabieren kann? Schwer zu sagen, da ich ohne Kinder das noch nie umsetzen könnte.. *nachdenk*
    #59AuthorLara Chu (AmE) (236716) 15 Jun 12, 17:23
    Comment
    Hi harambee, looking for something else entirely I happened upon a CC from about eight month ago in which you ask me whether I had recommended you a book, a question I never answered because I never saw it (I didn't spend much time on LEO around that time). So the very late answer is:

    I don't know.
     
    (But I might have, I love the book and probably talked about it at some point. Surely you've finished it by now, so if you remember, let me know what you thought.)
    #60AuthorGibson (418762) 16 Jun 12, 00:07
    Comment
    The problem about Latin, Ancient Greek, Mandarin etc. is that the first foreign language children learn should be (imho) one that enables them to communicate with people who don't speak their language.
    They can still learn a more future-orientated language when they start with their second foreign language.

    Also, as there won't be a reform on the secondary schools, how should children be able to improve the possibly exotic language they used to learn in primary school?
    And: Where to get enough teachers for those plans?

    -----------------

    Another thing I remember now as you're talking about spelling:
    My boy still spells words by using phonetic phonemes instead of the proper letters.
    "Dah" instead of "Dee", "Kah" instead of "Kay", and so on.
    In Germany, children learn to use the alphabet right in the beginning of primary school (and in nursery school, they are usually taught the ABC song)...
    #61AuthorThonatas (821337) 16 Jun 12, 02:53
    Comment
    I actually don't think it so important what language children learn first, but I think it is important they are exposed to other languages early, because they learn about languages.
    I learnt French in school (after English) and I never used it until I lived a while in France, about 10 years later, so there was very little use during my childhood (or better: teenage years).
    It is extremely useful now, as I work with languages and it helps to understand what I am looking at - and I am amazed how much I learnt actually is still (somewhere) available in my brain.
    So, any language will be useful - and children learn so easily languages so why not give them something different.

    On the spelling of words (so the kids won't understand): it always makes me laugh. I would hopeless with it. I have a hard time following someone who spells a word in German to me, in other languages I am hopeless. I have to visualise words, I would be lost at the point where someone spells, and would only catch up on the conversation five paragraphs later.

    I don't really follow the logic with the spelling in German - after all, German is quite phonetic (I know there are exceptions), so why not teach it right from the start? First and second graders don't write words seriously difficult words, so why not teach it right from the start.

    Now, if someone could tell me why they have to turn off the air condition at 6 pm? It gets really hot and stuff here.
    #62AuthorDixie (426973) 16 Jun 12, 03:26
    Comment
    In meiner Firma wird ausländischen Mitarbeitern Einzeluntericht in Deutsch von einem wirklich berühmten Institut angeboten.

    Die französische Lehrerin übersetzte den Satz "Ich wohne manchmal bei meinem Bruder und manchmal im Hotel" mit "Ich wohne ein bisschen da und ein bisschen da".

    Ich habe sie so freundlich wie möglich korrigiert, und das Ganze mit dem Spruch, "man kann auch nicht ein bisschen schwanger sein" aufgelockert, aber ich dachte sie frisst mich gleich auf.

    Die Bildungsproblematik fängt ganz eindeutig bei den Lehrern an.
    Ich hatte zum Beispiel nicht nur in der Grundschule sondern auch auf dem Gymnasium mit Lehrern zu kämpfen, die so schweren Dialekt sprachen, dass ich das erste halbe Jahr beinahe verpasst hätte. Sie waren teilweise sogar unfähig auf Nachfragen Hochdeutsch zu sprechen.

    Genug schwermütige Gedanken für heute Nacht. Gehe wieder auf die Mückenjagd.
    #63AuthorBea2_0 (677916) 16 Jun 12, 03:58
    Comment
    *hineinlunz*

    Das ist jetzt sehr gefährlich...ich wollte nur ein Wort nachschauen...welches? frage ich mich jetzt. Nun ja, das ist nun mal das Risiko, wenn man bei Leo schaut ;-)

    "Aufwerfen" im Sinne von einer Frage aufwerfen wollte ich nachschauen.

    Ich schreibe gerade meine Examensarbeit zur bilingualen Unterricht (eigentlich heißt es CLIL aber das könnte ihr nachschauen, wenn es euch näher interessiert) in der Hauptschule und muss etwas zur Mehrsprachigkeit schreiben, weil bei uns in der Gegend sind 70% der Schüler vermeintlich mehrsprachig sind. Je mehr ich lese, desto mehr Fragen werden aufgeworfen...aber das ist normal: Je mehr ich weiß, desto bewusster wird es mir, wie wenig ich weiß. Meine Güte, wie schlau ich vor dem Studium war ;-)
    Auf jeden Fall habe ich gemerkt, dass wir einfach annehmen, dass diese Schüler eine "richtige" Muttersprache haben, weil ihr Deutsch so schlecht ist (und wir es meistens auch nicht überprüfen können, wie gut oder schlecht die andere Sprache sei). Dann hatte ich eine einschlägige Erfahrung in einer 5.Klasse: 2 Kinder sollten ein Gespräch in ihrer Muttersprache vorspielen, damit wir als Nichtverstehende erraten konnten, worüber sie redeten. Aus 8-9 türkischen Kindern war nur eine in der Lage fließend zu reden - und das hatten sie offen in der Klasse diskutiert und war keine Sache von Schüchternheit. Auch das Mädchen gab zu, dass sie zwar relativ gut reden konnte, könnte aber nicht die Sprache nicht schreiben. Es ist ganz schön traurig, dass diese Kinder keine Sprache haben, in der sie sich adäquat ausdrücken können. Das sind die Kinder die dann in der Hauptschule landen und dann nach 6 Jahren Englischunterricht nicht mal das Niveau A1 (laut PISA) erreichen und das sind immerhin ca. 20%. (Ich gehe davon aus, als Sprachinteressierte, ihr wisst, was A1 ist).
    Mein Ansatz ist: Wenn ich es schaffe, diesen Kindern Englisch beizubringen, dann kann man alle kriegen ;-)
    Ich bin der Leo-Gemeinschaft nicht ganz entflohen…IRL bin ich in Frankfurt am Treffen ;-)


    Ich beantrage einen "Like" Knopf für Beiträge!!
    @Gibson: *like*


    #64Authorsuziq (315879) 16 Jun 12, 12:36
    Comment
    Gibson, you could have given the name and the author of the book as well ;-) Instead, you made me read an old CC (actually it was quite interesting and I spent much more time on reading than necessary), but finally I realized that you were talking about "Only Forward" by Michael Marshall Smith. In the meantime I have also found out that it was actually you who had recommended the book or the author: http://rude.leo.org/trainer/viewGeneraldiscus...

    I have to admit that I did not remember the book immediately and I was afraid that might be a bad sign, but it wasn't. I'm just bad in remembering names or authors of books I have read even if I had liked the books. But after looking up a review I remembered the book very well. So, the answer is: Yes, I did like "Only forward". It is really funny in parts, it is suspenseful und it is surprising. I wouldn't call it Science Fiction but maybe it is a special kind of SciFi?
    #65Authorharambee (91833) 16 Jun 12, 15:59
    Comment
    I was trying to be obscure. Seems to have worked ;)

    I'm glad you liked it; it bothers me if people don't like books that really grabbed me, much more so than with films or art or something. I feel very protective towards them. (Unless, of course, I don't like the people disliking the book. Then I don't care.)

    There are two more, 'Spares' and 'One of us', then he changes genre and style a bit. They're set in the future, so technically they're SF too. No aliens again, though. No ray-guns, either.

    I've just come back from a very wet 'Bücherbummel', an annual book market in Düsseldorf where you can pick up cheap books, most of them German, of course. But some stalls have English ones as well, so I came home with 7 new books, including one I already have but forgot that I had it. Oh well. One can't have too many books, can one...

    I've also ordered the second serious of the new Sherlock Homes. Should be here by Tuesday and I'm looking forward to several nights of good TV and lots of unhealthy food ;)

    I *like* that suziq likes my post :)
    #66AuthorGibson (418762) 16 Jun 12, 18:51
    Comment
    But "Only Forward" isn't a book everybody will like. So, you should expect a few less positive reviews ;-) I think I will look for the two other books you mentioned.

    Edit: I don't like the idea of introducing "I like" buttons at LEO. ;-)
    #67Authorharambee (91833) 16 Jun 12, 18:55
    Comment
    erm... 'series', not 'serious'.

    I also edited #66 before harambee wrote #67 so I'm not too worried... ;)
    #68AuthorGibson (418762) 16 Jun 12, 18:56
    Comment
    Oh yes, the "Unless"-sentence was not there when I posted. Thanks for the compliment! ;-)
    #69Authorharambee (91833) 16 Jun 12, 19:14
    Comment
    Anytime.
    #70AuthorGibson (418762) 16 Jun 12, 19:38
    Comment
    Gibson, then we must just have missed each other, I was there at about 4 p.m. ....
    #71Authorpenguin (236245) 16 Jun 12, 20:02
    Comment
    We might not have - I might have been the one elbowing you out of the way to get to the box with English books in the corner...

    (Or do we know what the other looks like? We haven't met and I forget, have we? I was actually wondering if any NRW LEOs would be there.)

    Anyway: did you have successful day?
    #72AuthorGibson (418762) 16 Jun 12, 20:10
    Comment
    No, I'm fairly sure we haven't met.

    I didn't buy anything and we ended up sheltering from the rain in a café instead.
    #73Authorpenguin (236245) 16 Jun 12, 20:13
    Comment
    I just wrote in another thread:

    Remind me to never cross you.

    and now I'm wondering if that should have been 'never to cross you'. Is there a difference? Is one of them simply wrong? I've completely confused myself now, and as this thread needs a push anyway, I'll ask you instead of the Sprachlabor, if that's all right.
    #74AuthorGibson (418762) 17 Jun 12, 22:02
    Comment
    I didn't even realise it was in English :). I probably tried:) too hard to find an answer to your question.
    #75AuthorDixie (426973) 17 Jun 12, 22:09
    Comment
    Don't put yourself down. I'm sure you were making an effort to find an answer.
    #76AuthorGibson (418762) 17 Jun 12, 22:34
    Comment
    :)
    I know there are not many soccer knowledgables around here, but still:
    Why are there German fans in green jerseys? I first thought they were Irish fans ...
    #77AuthorDixie (426973) 17 Jun 12, 22:42
    Comment
    I am watching the matches, but all the same don't seem to be a "knowledgeable". I don't have the slightest idea. Are they really wearing green?

    My sister just shared a wonderful story of her grandson who is just under two years of age:
    A few days ago, the young family went grocery shopping together - parents, grandson1 and grandson2 (who is just a few weeks old). When they came back, there was a very strong, weird smell in the apartment - and they found out the source pretty soon: just before they had left, grandson1 had put a sand mold and several lego bricks on a baking tin and put them in the oven which he set at 180°C!
    #78AuthorGoldammer (428405) 17 Jun 12, 23:09
    Comment
    Gibson, wenn man als Grammatiker strikt vorgeht, ist "to never cross" falsch, denn "to" und der Infinitiv gehören zusammen. Aber wenige halten sich an die Regel. Deshalb sind "never to cross" und "to never cross" gleich gültig. Ich würde persönlich "Remind me never to cross you" sagen.

    Grün ist historisch die Farbe der deutschen Auswärtskleidung (grünes Trikot und weiße Hose) für die Nationalmannschaft. Das sind die Farben des DFB(s). Da das heutige Spiel Dänemark - Deutschland war, war Deutschland die Auswärtsmannschaft - deshalb viel grün bei den Fans. Ich sehe bei Kicker.de aber, dass die Mannschaft die Heimkleidung getragen hat. Andere Auswärtsfarben sind grau und schwarz gewesen. Dank Jürgen Klinsmann war die Auswärtskleidung 2005-2008 rot.

    Eine Legende ist, dass sie grün tragen, weil das erste internationale Spiel nach dem 2. Weltkrieg gegen Irland war. Schöne Legende, leider falsch. Das erste international Spiel der Nachkriegszeit war gegen die Schweiz.
    #79AuthorRobert -- US (328606) 18 Jun 12, 00:00
    Comment
    Thank you Robert for the explanation. I never noticed green before (but then - I don't watch that many matches overall)
    Congratulations, btw, you managed to post exactly at midnight!
    #80AuthorDixie (426973) 18 Jun 12, 00:57
    Comment
    Oh my gosh, what idiots are running around in this world?

    My Tuesday evening relaxation (again, after I managed to stop it some two years ago) is not to be at home, because being at home isn't relaxing at all, with the local brass band (Blaskapelle) doing their weekly rehearsing right in front of my appartment. Not enough, yesterday (Sunday) they started to rehearse at a quatrer before twelve, Midday!

    A friendly call at the municipal office today to ask if it is really necessary that they rehearse in this street every week - even mentioning that I completely understand that this is their hobby and that they have to do rehearsings - when there are so many other places where they could do that without affecting a whole appartment block resulted in the question "And where would you suggest they rehearse?" Giving the man at the phone a few places with enough space and no immediate neighbours only led to the question "And how you think they should get there?" My still friendly answer was that they certainly all come by car to the rehearsal, what caused the answer "Well, they have all their stuff in the municipal centre, so they have to go there and have to do it there (the street is in 1 - 2 minutes walking distance at the back of this centre, one of my suggestions was a big place in front of the centre) and besides no one else complains. Good bye." And without giving me even a chance to reply he hung up. Another call landed at a woman who at least listened and promised she noted my request and will forward it. But really, after that idiot simply hung up I felt some sort of a killer instinct arise.

    Any of you who can imagine how fantastic it is to come home after work and instead of enjoying your leisure time you have to listen to 2 hours of rehearsing of a music style you absolutely dislike?

    Phew ... Sorry, guys, but I absolutely needed that now.

    It's hot enough here now, even without getting more hot in rage. Writing it down helped at least a little bit to cool down again.
    #81AuthorSachs (638558) 18 Jun 12, 12:56
    Comment
    Any of you who can imagine how fantastic it is to come home after work and instead of enjoying your leisure time you have to listen to 2 hours of rehearsing of a music style you absolutely dislike?

    Ja, das verstehe ich nur zu gut. Meine Nachbarn oben hören jeden Abend mexikanische Volksmusik. Manchmal so laut, dass ich nicht mal meinen eigenen Fernseher hören kann. Jeden. Abend.

    So... ich bin seit gestern offiziell Tante Lara.... *fettes grinsen!!!!!*
    #82AuthorLara Chu (AmE) (236716) 18 Jun 12, 14:45
    Comment
    Ooooohhh, congratulations, Lara!!!
    I'm an aunt since January, and it's fantastic! (By the way, did I tell you that my niece won't be the only one of her generation in our family from autumn on....? :) :) )
    #83Authorestrellita (236267) 18 Jun 12, 15:04
    Comment
    Ach, ich wollte als Erste gratulieren, aber estrellita war schneller! Wer kann gegen Licht konkurrieren?

    Ich gratuliere ganz herzlich, Lara! Viel Spaß mit dem Kleinen.

    *Sachs eine Vuvuzela schenk*

    Das war eine tolle Leistung von Robert, nicht wahr? Punkt Mitternacht etwas zu schreiben!

    *editier* Korrektürchen für estrellita: I am have been an aunt since January.
    #84AuthorAmy-MiMi (236989) 18 Jun 12, 15:09
    Comment
    Danke, danke! Und GRATULIERE, estrellita!!!!
    #85AuthorLara Chu (AmE) (236716) 18 Jun 12, 15:24
    Comment
    Thanks, Lara!
    (and sorry, Amy...)
    #86Authorestrellita (236267) 18 Jun 12, 15:36
    Comment
    Danke, aber das war ein glücklicher Zufall (serendipity). Wenn ich das hätte machen wollen, hätte es bestimmt nicht geklappt.

    Ich gratuliere, Lara und estrellita!

    Heute ist der letzte "normale" Schultag. Morgen und übermorgen schreiben die Schüler ihre Endprüfungen.
    #87AuthorRobert -- US (328606) 18 Jun 12, 17:03
    Comment
    @81, Sachs: 
    In the summer, my neighbour mows his lawn and all the meadows around our street with his terribly loud lawn tractor.
    Every single day.
    For hours.
    Especially terrible for me as a nighthawk and insomniac.

    Congratulations to our new aunties.
    #88AuthorThonatas (821337) 18 Jun 12, 17:24
    Comment
    Joining the club of aunts (for 18 months now).
    #89Authorbluesky (236159) 18 Jun 12, 18:20
    Comment
    Gratulation von mir auch. Dieser Faden wäre vielleicht für eure Fraktion geeignet:

    related discussion: jemanden babysitten

    Thonatas, jeden Tag mähen? Meine Güte, wie oft sprengt der denn, damit sein Gras so schnell wächst, etwa 3x täglich?

    Hier kommen die Mäher meist einmal in der Woche. Das Mähen selbst stört (mich) nicht so sehr wie das Blasen. Aber die bei mir zu Hause fangen im Sommer mit der Arbeit gerne pünktlich um 7:55 an (weil es ihnen später näturlich zu heiß wird) und am liebsten mit dem Luftblasdingsda gleich unter meinem Fenster (von den etwa 40 Reihenhäusern, die wir allen dieselbe 'blow-and-go'-Männer gebrauchen). Auch wenn ich zu dieser Stunde technisch schon 'wach' bin, ist das mal ein böses Erwachen.
    #90Authorhm -- us (236141) 18 Jun 12, 19:03
    Comment
    Die Luftblasdingsda sollten abgeschafft werden.

    @Thonatas: Jeden Tag? Na, das ist vielleicht übertrieben, oder wachsen die Grashalme schneller in England?

    Ist nighthawk vielleicht BE? Der Löwe hat keinen solchen Vermerk, aber ich kenne in diesem Sinne nur night owl, was allerdings sehhhr verdächtig Denglisch klingt, ist aber gebräuchlich.

    Es regnet! Gestern ,4 Zoll und heute? Das weiß ich nicht, denn es blitzt noch.

    @bluesky: Und hast du eine Nichte oder einen Neffen, oder hast du uns das schon gesagt? *vergesslich sei*

    *Robert zu den letzten Schultag gratulier*

    *editier*
    Schon 1,1 Zoll und draußen ist es viel kühler. Finde ich toll.
    #91AuthorAmy-MiMi (236989) 18 Jun 12, 19:12
    Comment
    A sweet little niece, Amy.
    #92Authorbluesky (236159) 18 Jun 12, 19:27
    Comment
    *neid*

    Danke übrigens für die ganzen Regenlieder im Mixtape-Faden, Amy. Bei euch scheinen sie schon gut geklappt zu haben. Hoffentlich tut das dem Garten gut. (-:
    #93Authorhm -- us (236141) 18 Jun 12, 19:35
    Comment
    @hm -- us & @amy - mimi
    They have a massive lawn and because of the extreme noise this lawn tractor is producing, you can still hear it from afar, which means that even if he is mowing a meadow which is far away from my house, I'd still hear it.
    And if he's not sitting on his lawn tractor, he cuts the lawns edges or his hedges with an equally loud bushcutter.
    Or helps his next door neighbours with their garden (their gardens are conjoined).
    And my region is one of the most fertile ones in Germany, I dare to say.


    I thought the same about "night owl", that's why I chose nighthawk instead.
    I can't really tell if it's BE or not.
    #94AuthorThonatas (821337) 18 Jun 12, 19:39
    Comment
    #91: aber ich kenne in diesem Sinne nur night owl

    Ich auch.
    #95AuthorKinkyAfro (587241) 18 Jun 12, 19:45
    Comment
    Belated edit, #94: If I think about it, the last statement of the first paragraph is simply wrong.
    But there was something special about my region.
    I think it was the average temperature.
    #96AuthorThonatas (821337) 18 Jun 12, 19:52
    Comment
    What about this painting called "Nighthawks"? http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/4/4a...

    Edit: Wikipedia says about it ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nighthawks ):
    Nighthawks is a 1942 painting by Edward Hopper that portrays people sitting in a downtown diner late at night. It is Hopper's most famous work and is one of the most recognizable paintings in American art.
    #97Authorharambee (91833) 18 Jun 12, 19:59
    Comment
    Isn't one of the really famous Hopper paintings (the one with Bogart and Monroe in a bar) called 'Nighthawks'?

    Thank you, Robert. I'll try to remember that (I should have been able to work that out, actually - I've known the rule ever since I first heard of 'Captain Kirk('s?) infinitive'. But I didn't think of it in terms of split infinitives.)

    Congratulations, Lara and Estrellita.

    *Sachs eine Vuvuzela schenk*
    Nooooo! I know you only meant it for self-defence, but still, they're terrible. Please don't.

    Edit: After reading #97, I realised that the Bogart version is somebody else's. But at least the bar I remembered correctly :(.

    #98AuthorGibson (418762) 18 Jun 12, 20:06
    Comment
    @hm: Ich schicke dir gerne etwas Regen. Könntest du mir etwas Motivation senden?

    Irgendwie habe ich 1991 nicht mitbekommen, dass Rodney King so *hust* jung war. Heute hörte ich seinen Alter und dachte, dass kann nicht wahr sein!

    *eine Schüssel leckere Wassermelonestückchen auf den Tisch stell*

    @bluesky: Das hast du uns sicher erzählt, aber ich bin inzwischen so vergesslich geworden,,,oder von mir eingenommen. *seufz*

    *editier* Der Name des Gemälde sagte mir nichts. Interessant, dass harambee und Gibson ihn kennen. Wie gesagt, Night Hawk sagt mir nichts. Ich kenne das nur als night owl.

    #99AuthorAmy-MiMi (236989) 18 Jun 12, 20:12
    Comment
    Thanks for the melons, Amy! I really need them now. A few months ago my office moved to a different room. In the past I always had my nice cool cellar room, but now I have a window on the west side of the building and in the late afternoon the blazing sun makes the room almost unbearably hot.
    #100Authorharambee (91833) 18 Jun 12, 20:20
    Comment
    *wassermelonestückchendankendakzeptier*

    Danke, Amy. Meine Motivation ist leider schon seit Monaten im Keller (na, wenn wir einen hätten), aber wenn du sie trotzdem haben willst, gerne, vielleicht macht sie bei dir oder wenigstens bei milderem Wetter fleißiger mit.

    Habt ihr dort im Norden auch immer noch Schule, wie Robert? Das wäre wie ein Monat Unterschied. Hab ich wohl schon letztes Jahr gesagt, sorry.

    Frage zur Debatte: Sind Beiträge, die nur aus zwei Wörtern bestehen, noch gültig, oder müssten Mitleser nicht wenigstens etwas über Nichten, Gras, *nachschlag* '(US) (lit) Amerikanischer Ziegenmelker; (fig) Nachtschwärmer' oder so was Spannendes sagen?

    (Ziegenmelker?! Wenn das nicht mal spannend ist ...)
    #101Authorhm -- us (236141) 18 Jun 12, 20:30
    Comment
    *Eistee auf den Tisch stell*

    @harambee: Den kannst du wahrscheinlich auch gebrauchen. Mein Mann hatte seinen Schreibtisch im Keller. Im Sommer ganz angenehm, nur etwas dunkel.

    Merriam-Webster kennt das Wort.
    http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/nig...

    *editier* Ich habe seit letzte Woche Ferien. (Deshalb bin ich hier tagsüber atktiver.) Und ich finde, zwei Wörter sind erlaubt. Ich möchte weder Erbsen noch einzlne Wörter zählen.

    #102AuthorAmy-MiMi (236989) 18 Jun 12, 20:31
    Comment
    *kleinenseufzerunterdrück*

    Okay, Entschuldigung, da hätte ich wohl einfach sagen sollen: Schön, Amy, dass du wieder öfter da bist, und schön, Kinky, dass du vorbeigekommen bist.

    harambee, 'Thanks for the melons' im Plural wären ganze Melonen; hier würde ich nur 'Thanks for the watermelon' (nicht zählbar, wie Obst) sagen.

    #103Authorhm -- us (236141) 18 Jun 12, 20:49
    Comment
    Komm, hm. Habe ich nicht so gemeint.

    *zu mir* Ich habe aber das mit dem Seufzen aber zuerst angefangen. *zu mir aus*

    Du brauchst dich nicht entschuldigen. Ich glaube nicht, dass meine Beiträge so interessant sind, dass jemand da sitzt und merkt, zu welcher Uhrzeit und wie oft ich etwas schreibe. Auf jeden Fall merkst du alles viel besser als ich mit meinen wenigen Gehirnzellen.

    Neue CC-Regel: Hier werden keine Erbsen und keine Melonen gezählt. Wörter dürfen gezählt werden.
    #104AuthorAmy-MiMi (236989) 18 Jun 12, 20:58
    Comment
    79.
    #105Authorhm -- us (236141) 18 Jun 12, 21:08
    Comment
    *empört sei* Etwas mehr als 79 Gehirnzellen habe ich aber doch. *zu mir* achtzig, einundachtzig, zweiundachtzig *weiter zähl*

    Übrigens, da wir heute gerne zählen, nur noch 5 Monate bis die Wahlen. Mehr kann ich wohl nicht aushalten.
    #106AuthorAmy-MiMi (236989) 18 Jun 12, 21:13
    Comment
    bis zu den Wahlen.

    Counting words is something I do every day before writing invoices ...

    Sorry, but this has been bugging me for quite some time now: Gibson, I still sense a hatchet extended towards me. Can't we bury it?
    #107Authorpenguin (236245) 18 Jun 12, 22:14
    Comment
    Thanks, Amy, for the "Vuvuzela" - I'm just afraid it won't be able to rival a whole brass band.

    Lawn mowers I know too, Thomatas, even if I suffer more in office from them than I do at home. There's a guy in the neighbourhood who mows the grass like other people iron their clothes - forward - backward - forward - backward - and again ... I suggested already to buy him a pair of nail scissors, he couldn't be slower with that, but it would make much less noise. And there are these neighbours who love to cut their own wood for winter, preferably Saturday morning when I'd like to sleep looooong ...

    Talking about - good night everyone.

    Edit:
    Where are my manners? Congrats to all "new-baked" aunts from me too - with three nephews and four nieces it's nothing so special any more, but the first one is.

    Really off to bed now
    #108AuthorSachs (638558) 19 Jun 12, 00:34
    Comment
    re #107:

    penguin, wegen #73-74? Aber ich habe Gibson so verstanden, dass sie irgendjemanden mit den Ellbogen beiseite gestoßen hätte, der zufällig zwischen ihr und einem Kasten englischen Büchern gestanden hätte. Also gar nichts Persönliches.

    Oder weil Gibson hier related discussion: You really try to speak German - #3 etwas kurz angebunden, um nicht schnippisch zu sagen, auf deinen auch ziemlich kurzen Beitrag reagiert hat? Aber dieser Faden war ja voller Missverständnisse, weil alles so sehr auf den Tonfall und so was ankommt.

    Oder Gibson, war das mit 'never cross you' wirklich irgendwann an pengu gerichtet und ich habe es einfach verpasst? (Und wenn, wo bitte, es wäre wenigstens gendergerecht, wenn es nicht immer nur die Kerle sind, die gelegentlich einander auf die Nerven gehen, aus einem Außenseitern nicht ganz nachvollziehbaren Grund.)

    Wenn ein Außenseiter einen Eindruck haben darf -- meine Vermutung wäre, dass ihr beiden einander einfach ein bisschen ähnlich sein könntet. Sehr entschlossen, mit der eigenen Meinung ziemlich schnell bei der Hand und nur an besseren Tagen bereit, Narren gerne zu dulden (wie sagt man eigentlich 'suffer fools gladly'). (Falls ihr jetzt vereint über mich herfallt, werde ich mich bestätigt fühlen. Entschuldigung bitte, wenn ich einfach die Klappe hätte halten sollen.)

    Ansonsten könnte jemand mal ein neues NRW-Treffen planen, damit ihr beiden unter anderem einander eher undramatisch kennenlernen könntet, und nach dem ersten Alt auch mit anderen Leuten plaudern.


    Sachs (oder wer auch immer), ist es eigentlich typisch, dass Stadtskappellen in deutschsprachigen Ländern im Freien üben? Hier wäre das wohl nicht mal eine Option, weil es draußen so heiß wird.
    #109Authorhm -- us (236141) 19 Jun 12, 00:54
    Comment
    Vuvuzelas darf man auch zählen.

    @Sachs: Ja, eine Vuvuzela ist nicht viel, aber wenn du Vuvuzela üben willst, stört das die Blaskapelle vielleicht doch ein bisschen.

    Korrektur der Wortstellung für Sachs (ist auch ein bisschen unfair, denn Sachs war ja müde, aber trotzdem): even if I suffer from them more in the office than I do at home...und dann: I already offered to buy him a pair of nail scissors...oder I already suggested that he buy a pair of nail scissors (kommt darauf an, was du sagen willst).

    #110AuthorAmy-MiMi (236989) 19 Jun 12, 04:53
    Comment
    Thanks for the corrections (and for blaming my tiredness for the mistakes), Amy. What I tried to say was: I fooled around with some friends, saying "Come on, let's buy a pair of nail scissors for this guy, he can't be slower with but a lot less noisy." So maybe I should have said "I suggested already to buy a pair of nail scissors for him ..." ?

    About the Vuvuzela: I thought rather about putting the Walkürenritt or something similar loud into my CD player, open the window and turn up as loud as possible. However, I'll give them the chance to change their habit till next week and spend the evening at my Mom's.

    I really don't know if this is a typical behaviour, hm. It is a routine here for many years now - but then I don't dare to say that there's something typical here. Sometimes I think the best name for this city would be "Schilda" the way things often are handled here. Besides: It's usually not that hot anymore between 7 and 9 p.m. It was indeed on Sunday noon.
    #111AuthorSachs (638558) 19 Jun 12, 09:51
    Comment
    Moin!

    This discussion is indeed difficult to follow - with all its links, filaments and ramifications.
    "to never cross you" actually referred to Dixie, who revealed some expertise in customs of the IRA in a thread on mass cards.
    "79" referred to the number of words in the preceding posting, not to the number of Amy-MiMi's brain cells.
    "try" and "making an effort" belongs to yet another thread of misunderstandings.
    And, on top of it, the noise of mowing machines, brass bands and Sachs blowing his new vuvuzela!
    "die Kerle" - oh, oh - I am so peaceful a person, I even had to look up "hatchet"!
    #112AuthorEmil 14 (299747) 19 Jun 12, 15:08
    Comment
    Vielleicht kann Sachs' Stadtskapelle zu mir im Büro kommen, um mich ein wenig aufzuwecken...
    #113AuthorLara Chu (AmE) (236716) 19 Jun 12, 15:14
    Comment
    I think there have been some misunderstandings, so I'll try to explain:

    Yes, there was a hatchet instance between penguin and me quite a long time ago, but I thought that was more or less done and dusted, and even if not, I wouldn't bring LEO issues into the CC. So I'm not really sure what #107 refers to, but I'll go through hm's suggestions:

    73/74: Yes, that was a joke - I didn't really think that I'd pushed Penguin, nor would I want to, I just liked the idea that we'd met without realising it. In fact, I didn't push anybody that day, I was quite well-behaved.

    My comment in 'try to speak German' was in answer to Illdiko (now that's a completely different case, not-getting-on-wise! But we won't go there), not to Penguin.

    My comment about 'not crossing' was directed at Dixie from a different thread (related discussion: mass card (Ireland)) and of course a joke.

    I honestly didn't mean to come across as offended, offensive, hatched-throwing or similar and especially not here. If I did, I'm sorry, but I'd still like to know where and how so I don't do it again. I don't mind stepping on people's toes occasionally but I prefer doing it on purpose ;).

    So, Penguin, if you prepare the spare ribs I'll bring the drinks for the official hatched-burying event 2012. There'll be music and dance but strictly no vuvuzelas.
    #114AuthorGibson (418762) 19 Jun 12, 15:27
    Comment
    I don't mind stepping on people's toes occasionally but I usually do it on purpose ;)
    So I've noticed ;-)

    Gibson, I have buried the hatchet long ago, and I'm glad that to learn you've done the same. No danger of vuvuzelas here, neither do I like the sound of them nor do I watch football. However, I don't like spare ribs. So what do we do now?
    #115Authorpenguin (236245) 19 Jun 12, 15:35
    Comment
    So what was the trigger for #107? I still don't know that.

    Chocolate mousse?
    #116AuthorGibson (418762) 19 Jun 12, 15:49
    Comment
    Just something that's been at the back of my mind for a while. No specific trigger.

    Chocolate mousse is fine.
    #117Authorpenguin (236245) 19 Jun 12, 15:50
    Comment
    Chocolate mousse it is.

    (But you do the washing up. For spare ribs we could have used paper plates. Now we need proper crockery.)
    #118AuthorGibson (418762) 19 Jun 12, 16:02
    Comment
    "79" referred to the number of words in the preceding posting, not to the number of Amy-MiMi's brain cells.

    Oh, danke, Emil. Die Empörung hätte ich mir sparen können.

    Vielleicht sollten wir Beile und Vuvuzelas begraben.

    @Sachs: suggested to buy geht nicht. Dann solltest du deinen Satz so formulieren: I already suggested (that) he buy nail scissors...

    *editier*
    *zu mir* Ob Gibson vielleicht doch ein bisschen aggressiver ist, als ich dachte? I didn't push anybody that day

    #119AuthorAmy-MiMi (236989) 19 Jun 12, 16:15
    Comment
    Für Schokoladenmousse braucht man eigentlich nur eine riesengroße Schüssel voll davon und viele Löffel :o)
    #120AuthorLara Chu (AmE) (236716) 19 Jun 12, 16:24
    Comment
    @Lara: Dir wollte ich laute Musik schicken, war nur unschlüssig, was für Musik ich aussuchen sollte. *Topf auf den Boden fallen lass* Hoppla. Vielleicht hilft das?
    #121AuthorAmy-MiMi (236989) 19 Jun 12, 16:30
    Comment
    Geht's noch lauter, Amy?
    #122AuthorLara Chu (AmE) (236716) 19 Jun 12, 16:39
    Comment
    *aufschreck*

    Wer schmeißt hier so früh morgens Töpfe auf den Boden? Das ist ja schlimmer als diese Luftblasdingsdas.

    Ich würde vorschlagen, zum Essen oder Kaffee oder auf ein Bier oder was auch immer auszugehen, damit niemand abwaschen muss. Aber Schokoladenmouße in einem Café klingt durchaus vielversprechend.

    Eigentlich, wenn es sich um penguin handelte, würde ich schon anbieten abzuwaschen, wenn eine Chance bestehen würde, dass sie kocht. Aber ich schätze, als Unbekannter müsste man sie zuerst für sich einnehmen. (Steht im WB zu 'get on her good side', hoffentlich stimmt das auch und ich stifte keine weiteren Missverständnisse.)

    Gut immerhin zu wissen, dass es nichts Ernstes war. Und auch, dass Amy mehr als 79 Gehirnzellen hat. (Ich dagegen, na ja, es ist wie gesagt noch früh und die Nerven noch etwas zerbrechlich ...)
    #123Authorhm -- us (236141) 19 Jun 12, 16:46
    Comment
    Hi snails! I know i haven't been here for a long time, but now I'm in urgent need of the help of an ENS ... anybody here at the moment?
    #124Authoratalante (480508) 19 Jun 12, 17:38
    Comment
    Wenn es sich um etwas Kurzes handelt, ja, per PM oder im Forum oder hier, aber E-Mail habe ich im Augenblick nicht, das wäre etwas umständlicher ...
    #125Authorhm -- us (236141) 19 Jun 12, 17:42
    Comment
    Ok, it's something short, I'll send you a PM! :-)
    #126Authoratalante (480508) 19 Jun 12, 17:43
    Comment
    What do I read there? Chocolate mousse in a big bowl with many spoons? Who's invited?? (And is it prepared without raw egg...?)
    I could offer pipes of peace made of liqorice, maybe I should just leave some here in case there should be any need in the future.
    #127Authorestrellita (236267) 19 Jun 12, 18:51
    Comment
    Lakritze statt Essiggurken? Ich hätte eigentlich auch letztere zu bieten, heimgemacht sogar, wenn auch nicht von mir selbst. Sehr scharf. Eine Bekannte von uns ist früh in die Rente gegangen, wieder geheiratet und in ein schönes altes Haus eingezogen, und hat jetzt einen großen Gemüsegarten und kocht und macht ein, was das Zeug hält. Ich werde müde davon, nur von ihr zu hören.

    Gut immerhin, dass hoffentlich nicht zu viele Friedenspfeifen hier nötig sein werden. Es ist ja beruhigend zu wissen, dass z.B. Emil friedfertig ist.

    Und gut auch, e*, dass du gerade keine rohen Eier essen darfst -- vielleicht bedeutet das um so mehr virtuelle Schokoladenmouße für uns. (-;
    #128Authorhm -- us (236141) 19 Jun 12, 19:41
    Comment
    Brrrr, gherkins, I SO do not fulfil the prejudices there!
    But an old house with vegetables (and fruit) in the garden, one of my dreams I'll probably never reach - but as you say, it's very demanding, so it's probably better to only dream about it.
    #129Authorestrellita (236267) 19 Jun 12, 19:54
    Comment
    Amy #99: Der Name des Gemälde sagte mir nichts. Interessant, dass harambee und Gibson ihn kennen.

    Very impressive, isn't it? Unfortunately, it is true only for Gibson. :-) I am kind of a philistine when it comes to paintings. I like to look at them sometimes and I have visited one or two museums in the past and thoroughly enjoyed it. However, I don't remember names of painters or paintings and you could probably sell me a Klee for a Miro ;-)

    Actually, I had been looking for some (pop) songs with "nighthawk" in the title because I was quite sure that such songs existed. I even found a few but they were not the ones I was looking for. Instead I found the painting mentioned above and decided to share it with you. I should have made clear from the beginning that I had found it through a Google search.
    #130Authorharambee (91833) 19 Jun 12, 20:04
    Comment
    "Nighthawk" hört sich an wie ein Mitglied der X-Men... :o)
    #131AuthorLara Chu (AmE) (236716) 19 Jun 12, 20:10
    Comment
    Sorry, I don't have a recipe for chocolate mousse (in German, Schokoladenmousse or Mousse au chocolat, no 'ß' anywhere near ;-)) that does not use raw egg - but I am warning you: It will be white chocolate mousse, with maracujá (passion fruit) on top. Unless you'd prefer me to make a huge bowl of Tiramisu instead? But that also contains raw egg .... I'll make some custard for estrellita.
    #132Authorpenguin (236245) 19 Jun 12, 21:07
    Comment
    How did I get from forum bully to art expert in 10 short postings? The CC moves in mysterious ways...

    Thank you 6g/ for the flowers /6g, harambee, but as you can see, I placed some people in the painting who have no business being there, so my expert knowledge is quite close to yours ;)

    #131 reminds me that I once channel-surfed* into the beginning/credits of some series called 'The Beastmaster', someting about a Conan-type guy fighting all the bad guys in his forest (?), all with dramatic music and losts of close ups of his muscles, and then the deep voice-over said something like '... and he is accompanied by his true and brave friend, the stoat', and I laughed out loud. I had expected a lion, a cheetah, at least a wolf. But a stoat? I was not impressed.

    *is 'zappen' a 'Handy' word, or do you say that in English?
    #133AuthorGibson (418762) 19 Jun 12, 21:08
    Comment
    Für mich erinnert es an das Nighthawk Café (oder hieß es schon Restaurant?), wo wir immer nach Konzerten hingegangen sind, als wir in meiner Kindheit in die Stadt fahren mussten, um Kammermusik und so zu hören. Von den Streichquartetten habe ich nicht viel, oder eher nur passiv etwas mitbekommen, da meine Aufmerksamkeit eher dem Programmheft gewidmet war, wo ich mit Bleistift laut kritzelte und die erwachsenen Konzertbesucher wahrscheinlich nervte. Aber danach bin ich immer wieder aufgewacht, wenn es ein Milkshake im Nighthawk gab. Es war nicht kalt, dunkel und trostlos wie im Hopper, eher herzlich und zwanglos, mit vielen Separéen (stimmt das wirklich zu 'booths'?), wo man bequem federnd (?) sitzen konnte. Vielleicht war ich schon in diesem frühen Alter ein Abendmensch.
    #134Authorhm -- us (236141) 19 Jun 12, 21:10
    Comment
    Gibson: Ich glaube "to zap" geht auf Englisch. Ich kenne zumindest Leute, die die Fernbedienung als "zapper" bezeichnen. Wo ich aufgewachsen bin, sagten wir "flicker" für die Fernbedienung und "to flick to a channel/between channels". Sage ich immer noch und werde oft schief angeschaut, weil anscheinend "zapper" oder "flipper" hier geläufiger sind.

    PS: "The Beastmaster" klingt wirklich lächerlich!
    #135AuthorLara Chu (AmE) (236716) 19 Jun 12, 21:17
    Comment
    Huch, eine Stunde niemand da und dann plötzlich Leben. Guten Abend, die Damen.

    Hi, penguin, wieso denn kein ß, 'ou' ist doch ein langes Vokal, oder? Nicht fair. Oder müsste ich es 'Mus' schreiben und würde das nicht eher zu Verwirrung führen?

    Und ... Maracujá darauf? Hmm ... *eher skeptisch sei*

    Hi, Gibson, ich wenigstens finde 'channel-surf' in diesem Zusammenhang schon plausibler als 'zap', aber mal sehen, was die anderen sagen. 'Going through the channels'? 'Skipping from channel to channel'? 'Looking for something to watch'?

    *f5* Nein, wenn Lara meint, es sei richtig, ist es wohl tatsächlich, never mind.

    Stoat ist eins dieser sehr sehr britischen Wörter, bei dem ich mich nie so richtig irgendein Tier vorstellen konnte. (Stimmt aber, bestimmt nichts Heldenhaftes.) Das Wort allein erinnert an 'stolid' und 'moat', oder vielleicht 'boat' ...
    #136Authorhm -- us (236141) 19 Jun 12, 21:21
    Comment
    flick, that's it. I knew there had to be a less cumbersome word than 'channel-surfing'. I definitely know flicking through channels, so you're not alone. At least one German woman from the Ruhrgebiet knows it too.

    hm, but you still like concerts, don't you? So being bored obvioulsy didn't put you off. Maybe the key is to combine culture with milk shakes.
    #137AuthorGibson (418762) 19 Jun 12, 21:21
    Comment
    —> mir?
    #138Authorhm -- us (236141) 19 Jun 12, 21:22
    Comment
    hm -- us, because it's derived from French, I presume:
    http://www.duden.de/rechtschreibung/Mousse

    Maracujá is a nice, sharp contrast to the sweet white mousse.
    #139Authorpenguin (236245) 19 Jun 12, 21:24
    Comment
    mich ;)

    But 'Das Wort allein erinnert an' (without any kind of pronoun) actually sounds very elegant, if a wee bit old-fashioned.
    #140AuthorGibson (418762) 19 Jun 12, 21:27
    Comment
    Stelle mich vor? Hmm.

    Ja, wenn man doch nur während des Konzertes am Milkshake nippen dürfte ...

    Maracujá hat harambee schon mal erwähnt und ich war mir nicht sicher, ob ich überhaupt weiß, wie es (sie?) schmeckt. Offensichtlich eine Geschmackslücke.
    #141Authorhm -- us (236141) 19 Jun 12, 21:33
    Comment
    Oh, sorry, I misread. I thought you meant the 'erinnern' bit, which looked a bit bare without a 'mich'. I didn't see 'mich vorstellen'. You're right, of course: mir.

    (Obwohl du dich natürlich gerne vorstellen kannst. Wer waren Sie noch mal?)
    #142AuthorGibson (418762) 19 Jun 12, 21:35
    Comment
    Eiiiigentlich bin ich kein Fan von weißer Schokolade, aber mit Maracujasoße obendrauf werde ich wohl eine Ausnahme machen müssen. ;o) Diese Pfirsich-Maracuja Froop-dings waren immer so lecker.

    'The Beastmaster' hat mich eben daran erinnert, dass ich euch von einer Fernsehserie, die in den USA gerade läuft, erzählen wollte. Vielleicht findet ihr das auch amüsant.
    Die Serie heißt 'Grimm' und basiert (locker) auf den Märchen. Der Hauptfigur kämpft gegen (und im Namen von) verschiedenen Wesen. Das Wort 'Wesen' wird auch auf Englisch benutzt, wird aber wie "wessen" ausgesprochen. Zu den verschiedenen Wesens gehören Hexenbiests, Eisbibers, Bludbaden, Bauerschweine, Dämenfeuers, usw.
    Bisher habe ich nur zwei oder drei Folgen gesehen, aber ich muss jedesmal, wenn ein pseudo-deutsches Wort verwendet wird, schmunzeln.
    #143AuthorLara Chu (AmE) (236716) 19 Jun 12, 21:39
    Comment
    Hi again! Now that I got very helpful assistance with my problem by hm--us I can relax again, at least a bit. In the last few months I had an awful lot to do, but nothing that would have been interesting enough to tell you (at least I think so), so I didn't write anything. But now that it seems that there are sigificant amounts of various mousses au chocolat due, I think I'll try to come around more often.
    #144Authoratalante (480508) 19 Jun 12, 21:59
    Comment
    Lara gladly sending the whole "Stadtkapelle". But to my big surprise somehow my phone call seemed not to haven fallen completely on deaf ears - they rehearsed two streets away today. Not one of the places I would have suggested, but I think it's fine there, surrounded by several school buildings and in acceptable distance from appartment houses. Keep your fingers crossed they liked that place and will return there in future.

    Amy, I know, it would be a question for another thread, but may I come back once again to the sentence you were already so kind to correct? Maybe one of MY 79 brain cells works a bit slow at present or maybe it's already too late again, but: Why is "suggested to buy" impossible (you remember, I never had good grammar lessons, so almost all I write is by gut feeling) ?

    White Mousse au chocolat sounds alluring - is there a spoon left for me? Therefore I can offer an almost full can of salted peanuts for all those of you who don't like it too sweet at that time of the day.

    #145AuthorSachs (638558) 19 Jun 12, 22:21
    Comment
    Tja, vor der Fernsehsendung gab es den Film "Beastmaster", sogar drei Filme. Die waren auch nicht die b(i)esten. (Übrigens, es soll 2013 ein romantischer Krimi-Horrorfilm aus Österreich erscheinen, der "Biest" heißt. Mit einem Haushaltsplan von 30,000 Euro scheint das mir nicht vielversprechend.)

    Ein stoat im Winterfell heißt "ermine" - schon etwas eleganter. Im Film hatte der Beastmaster jedoch eine Großkatze (drei Arten, je nach Film), einen Raubvogel und zwei Frettchen.
    http://www.imdb.com/find?q=beastmaster&s=all

    wenn man doch nur während des Konzertes am Milkshake nippen dürfte ...
    Aber dann hätte man das Problem mit Zutschen während des Konzerts. Bei einem Rockkonzert ginge das, aber bei einem Konzert mit klassischer Musik?

    *frische Erdbeeren ausstell*
    #146AuthorRobert -- US (328606) 19 Jun 12, 22:30
    Comment
    Mini doorlet for hm: mit vielen Separées (not Separéen). I would only talk in fancy restaurants about a Separée, not in a diner or anything in that direction. I was trying to remember how I would call these in German, but I cannot think of the right word.
    Lara, would you recommend Grimm? With the summer offering on tv being rather boring I could do with something interesting, just for the odd evening when I am too tired to think after work.
    *Enjoying Robert's strawberries* many thanks. Strawberries are my favourite fruits.
    #147AuthorDixie (426973) 20 Jun 12, 01:45
    Comment
    Perhaps “Separée” could be changed to “Nische” if the separée was not a closed room. “Das Restaurant hat auch ein paar schöne Nischen”. I do not know whether this use is really common or not. I would say "Nische" without too much hesitating.

    @Robert: “Mit einem Budget (Haushaltsplan) von 30,000 Euro scheint das mir nicht vielversprechend.“ „Haushaltsplan“ brings politicians to my inner eye.

    Is still some of the mousse au chocolat left? I will even bring my own ladle ;-)

    In exchange I could offer some cheesecake, woodruff torte and blueberry muffins.
    #148AuthorHe-le-na (743297) 20 Jun 12, 11:00
    Comment
    Ich habe nicht genug Folgen von 'Grimm' gesehen, um die Serie zu emphelen oder nicht, Dixie. Aber meine Schwester und ihr Mann schalten regelmäßig ein, ein Freund von mir auch. Im Sommer ist die Auswahl im Fernsehen eh relativ dürftig. Grimm ist vielleicht eine der wenigen guten Serien?

    Nur noch zwei Arbeitstage, dann habe ich am Freitag frei und fliege zu meinem Neffen!
    #149AuthorLara Chu (AmE) (236716) 20 Jun 12, 14:43
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    Dixie, meine auch.

    Nur noch drei Stunden mit Schülern.
    #150AuthorRobert -- US (328606) 20 Jun 12, 18:11
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    I had to look up the word "zutschen" :-) I don't think I've ever heard it.
    #151Authorharambee (91833) 20 Jun 12, 20:01
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    Guten Tag zusammen.

    Ich habe angenommen, es muss wohl 'slurp' bedeuten, aber jetzt, wo du es erwähnst ... 'Zutschen' steht nicht in meinem WB und 'slurp' soll 'schlürfen' heißen.

    Trotzdem klingt es, ähm, interessant. (-:

    Zu 'booths': Vielleicht hätte ich etwas wie 'gepolsterte Sitzbanken' oder so verwenden sollen? Für mit ist das Getrenntsein eigentlich nicht der Punkt (6g?), zumal es keine Trennwänder gibt, alles ist offen, man bleibt immer noch mitten im Raum.
    #152Authorhm -- us (236141) 20 Jun 12, 20:29
    Comment
    Jetzt jubeln die Schüler, sie sind bis September "frei". Am Ende der letzten Stunde zeigte ich "Jetzt ist Sommer" von den Wise Guys. Bei dieser Klasse ist das nun Tradition. Wir Lehrer jubeln auch, nur nicht so laut.

    Zu zutschen: related discussion: zutschen
    (Sonst hätte ich "schlürfen" geschrieben.)
    #153AuthorRobert -- US (328606) 20 Jun 12, 21:40
    Comment
    ein romantischer Krimi-Horrorfilm aus Österreich for 30,000 Euros - now there's a must-see! Especially if they have some Bauerschweine and Dämenfeuers in it as well.

    Wir Lehrer jubeln auch, nur nicht so laut.
    *gg*

    Happy nephew visiting, Lara. Don't forget to take a drum kit for when he's a bit older.

    I don't think 'Nischen' works here if my mental image of hm's Nighthawk café is right. We just don't have that kind of layout, so I'm not sure there's a short to-the-point expression for it. 'Gepolsterte Sitzbänke' (red? I see red in my mind's eye) is a good description but a bit long, no? I might be enough to say something like 'wie ein typisch Amerikanisches diner' - most people know those from films, and they always have booths.
    #154AuthorGibson (418762) 20 Jun 12, 21:50
    Comment
    Has anyone heard of Steve? Is he still in hospital?
    #155Authorleo029 (14476) 20 Jun 12, 22:58
    Comment
    Nicht seit dem Anfang des Fadens. Steve kommt und geht hier im CC, also nehme ich an, dass das Leben mal wieder zu voll fürs Quasseln wurde. Hoffentlich geht's ihm verhältnismäßig gut. :o)

    Ich wünsche, ich könnte schon Feierabend machen. Ich bin so aufgeregt und freue mich so auf das Wochenende, dass ich mich überhaupt nicht auf meine Arbeit konzentrieren kann.
    #156AuthorLara Chu (AmE) (236716) 21 Jun 12, 16:01
    Comment
    @leo029: Ich habe nichts von Steve gehört. Falls einer von uns was privat mitkriegt, könnten wir fragen, ob wir die Nachricht die Gruppe mitteilen dürfen.

    *Tentakel, Daumen, Zehen und Nasen für Steve drück*

    @Sachs: Re suggest to buy: Vielleicht solltest du hier klicken: related discussion: Das leidige Gerundium

    @Robert: Viel Spaß beim leise Jubeln. Been there, done that. *gg*

    @Gibson: Ja, oft sind die gepolsterten Sitzbänke rot.

    Don't forget to take a drum kit for when he's a bit older. Meine Neffen bekamen etwas drum-kit-Ähnliches von einer Schwester meines Schwagers. Obwohl ich auch nur eine Tante bin, dachte ich schon: Wie könnte sie nur so was Blödes schenken? Das Geschenk war entweder laut und nervend oder gefährlich. Und da meine Schwester drei Buben hat (Zwillinge und ihren Bruder, der knapp 18 Monate älter ist), war das Geschenk mal 3.

    @Lara: Ich wünsche dir viel Spaß beim Neffen-Besuchen. Hast du was Schönes gehäkelt? Oder gestrickt?
    #157AuthorAmy-MiMi (236989) 21 Jun 12, 16:13
    Comment
    Congratulations to Lara and estrellita.

    @ Gibson (and Lara)
    If you have children of your own who are not too old for a drum kit (or still intend to have children) I would not do this. Revenge of your brother / sister would follow ;-)

    #158AuthorHe-le-na (743297) 21 Jun 12, 16:21
    Comment
    Nein Amy :o( Ich bin ziemlich ungeschickt und tue mich immer noch schwer mit dem Häkeln. Einen Fotorahmen habe ich aber gebastelt.

    Der Kleine kriegt von mir bestimmt kein Schlagzeug. Meine Schwester kann schnell böse werden und entzieht Wochen oder Monate lang Kontakt. Dieses Risiko gehe ich nicht ein!
    #159AuthorLara Chu (AmE) (236716) 21 Jun 12, 16:27
    Comment
    chocolate mousse with ladles and spoons will be served here
    #160Authorpenguin (236245) 21 Jun 12, 17:29
    Comment
    Diese Glücklichen!
    #161AuthorLara Chu (AmE) (236716) 21 Jun 12, 17:43
    Comment
    Too far away, penguin :-( And they won't add passion fruit, will they?
    #162Authorharambee (91833) 21 Jun 12, 17:50
    Comment
    *thinkingaboutmovingbacktoNRW* *ggg*
    Lara, all the best for getting to know your nephew! (I hope this doesn't sound like "I wish you all the best - you'll need it" but rather like "alles Gute und viel Spaß!")
    #163Authorestrellita (236267) 21 Jun 12, 17:50
    Comment
    @harambee: Zuerst war ich mir nicht sicher, ob du teilnehmen darfst, denn ich habe ladies statt ladles gelesen. Chocolate mousse mit laddies, da will ich hin. *Scotchterrier mag*

    Hoffentlich esst ihr die Mousse nicht mit Schaufeln.

    @Lara: Überlegst du dir noch, als Deutschlehrerin um zu satteln? Es gibt eine interessante Stelle in deiner Nähe (obwohl ich eigentlich nicht so genau weiß, wo do wohnst). Irgendwo an der Ostküste, nicht wahr? Nicht weit vom Atlantik. Maine, New York, North Carolina. In der Gegend. *schmunzel* Falls es dich interessiert, schicke ich dir die Infos. Falls du die noch nicht hast. Die habe ich von AATG. *zu mir* Gesundheit!
    #164AuthorAmy-MiMi (236989) 21 Jun 12, 20:07
    Comment
    Meinst du die Meldung von gestern, Amy? Wenn ja, dann habe ich schon angefangen, meine Unterlagen vorzubereiten. Ich bin noch unentschlossen, weil ich in den kommenden Wochen evtl. was von einer Firma hören werde, die schon im April Interesse an mir gezeigt hat -- nur halt weiterhin in der Übersetzungsbranche, nur quasi als Projektmanagerin statt Sklavin--ähm, Übersetzerin. Lehrerin werden ist ein völlig neuer Weg, den ich einschlagen muss und mit Übersetzungstätigkeiten weiß ich schon, worauf ich mich einlasse. Decisions, decisions. Bewerben werde ich mich allemal, weil man ja nie weiß, was so kommen könnte :o)
    #165AuthorLara Chu (AmE) (236716) 21 Jun 12, 20:16
    Comment
    Talking about unburied hatchets: Did you hear of the "war" between the American Olympic Committee and the American members of the Online Community Ravelry (Ravelry is an incredibily huge community of knitters from all over the world, they have more than two million members). If not, here are two links:
    http://knitting.about.com/b/2012/06/21/u-s-ol...
    http://gawker.com/5920036/us-olympics-committ...

    I think the ravelry members are not upset because of the claim for a name change, but mainly because the letter of the Olympic committee tends to belittle the values of knitting.

    No, I'm not a knitter, but I know a few ;-)
    #166Authorharambee (91833) 21 Jun 12, 20:18
    Comment
    Erkältet oder Allergien, Amy? Gesundheit von mir auch.

    Ja, Lara, viel Spaß mit dem neuen Neffen. (Neffenchen? Neffchen? Nefflein?) Vielleicht ein Buch oder eine CD mit Wiegenliedern oder so, für deine Schwester.

    Hoffentlich kommen noch ein paar NRWler. Mitten im Sommer ist vielleicht nicht die beste Zeit, alle auf einmal zu Hause zu erwischen, aber es war früher eine nicht zu kleine Gruppe, nicht wahr? Wäre auch nett, wenn Chaja den Gottesdienst nicht verpassen müsste, aber vielleicht gibt es auch am Samstagmorgen einen.

    Habe ich übrigens erwähnt, dass es gestern hier geregnet hat? Sehr schön, fast eine halbe Stunde oder so. Mit Donner und allem.
    #167Authorhm -- us (236141) 21 Jun 12, 20:56
    Comment
    You'd better not go to the loo when you watch the Olympics, then - that would deny the athletes respect and stuff even more.
    I'm not entirely up-to-date on the values of knitting, though, I have to admit. Does that work towards world peace, too?

    What's wrong with a nice little drum kit? Kid's hardly been born and he's already curbed in his ways of expressing himself.

    Good luck with the project managing project, Lara. You should add a couple of CC threads to your CV to show both your fantastic range of German and your infinite patience in the face of adversity.

    harambee, don't you sometimes fly from Düsseldorf Airport? Maybe it's time for a trip, then you could tie it in with the Stammtisch. Aren't you tempted? Ladies, laddies, a range of cutlery, great dessert and an assortion of fauna?

    hm, there's a thunderstorm just starting here. The sky's really dark, the wind just slammed my window shut and it looks quite scary out there. (not tornado scary, of course, but for sweet safe Germany it's quite impressive)
    #168AuthorGibson (418762) 21 Jun 12, 21:01
    Comment
    Danke, Gibson, dass du meine Deutschkentnisse zum (glaube ich) zweiten Mal lobst :o) Das bedeutet mir nämlich ganz viel.

    @hm: das heißt, die Lieder von Amy im Mix-Tape-Faden haben was gebracht! Jippiii!

    Huch, es ist schon 15:45! Nicht mehr lange, dann gibt's Feierabend.

    Hat einer von euch mal Pillars of the Earth von Ken Follett gelesen? Ich hab's gestern bestellt (zusammen mit Birdsong -- die Verfilmung war ganz gut, und wenn eine Verfilmung gut ist, dann ist das Buch bestimmt noch besser...) Langsam wächst mein "To Read" Stapel wieder.
    #169AuthorLara Chu (AmE) (236716) 21 Jun 12, 21:48
    Comment
    I've read Pillars of the Earth two or Three times, I guess... I really like it and can definitely recommend it.
    How I hate the auto-correct function on my phone!! Everything takes twice as long to type!
    There's a thunderstorm outside here too. A good thing since it has been so humid these past days and I can't stand that. It makes me feel aggressive without wanting to...
    I'm off to bed now to hopefully finish A feast for crows and then start with A dance with Dragons which I bought today. I cannot wait... :-)
    Night, all!
    #170AuthorAbertawe (809721) 21 Jun 12, 22:45
    Comment
    Thanks for the link, Amy. Does that mean I have to learn all these words? Or can I still count on your corrections in case of failing again? ;-)

    Do I guess right it was neither a cold nor an allergic reaction but only AATG?

    The German version of Pillar of the Earth should be somewhere in my shelves, unread yet.

    But my thanks to all of you who recommended the "Game of Thrones". I checked my local book shop for it already some weeks ago, but hesitated 'cause the price seemed a bit too high for a paperback. Three weeks ago I checked A***** for it and got the first 4 books now at about the same price only the first one would have been here. Well - it's the English version now instead of the German, but who cares? My English can only benefit of it. Even if there are ocassional words / phrases even LEO doesn't know. Just as an example: I still didn't find out what kind of a tree a "sentinel" is. Not even a whole thread here was able to clarify that, because after the very detailed description in the book I don't believe it is simply any particularly high tree but think it has to be a certain tree. Maybe one that only exists in the fantasy world though? Did someone read the German version and knows how it is translated there?

    We had very heavy rains and thunderstorms already yesterday - with closed streets due to landslips, a river in danger to burst its banks and basements filled with water. More rain today, but not that heavy anymore. It's still raining now. So if anyone's in need of ...
    #171AuthorSachs (638558) 21 Jun 12, 23:53
    Comment
    Es freut mich total, dass ihr Game of Thrones lest! Das ist wirklich eine meiner Lieblingsserien. Sachs, 'sentinel trees' sind Kiefer (?) (pine trees/coniferous trees).
    #172AuthorLara Chu (AmE) (236716) 22 Jun 12, 01:11
    Comment
    Ich habe Pillar of the Earth gelesen und fand das Buch gut. Ich kann es nur empfehlen.

    Jetzt bin ich offiziell saisonbedingt arbeitslos (seasonally unemployed). Viele Leute meinen, wir hätten elf Wochen Urlaub. Das ist aber nicht der Fall. Lehrer bekommen kein Entgelt oder Gehalt. Im Sommer haben wir keine Arbeit, außer wenn wir etwas finden oder in der Sommerschule lehren. Ich aber mache eine Reise. Heute war ein "Schüler freier" Tag; wir mussten die Noten einreichen, das Zimmer aufräumen, die Schlüssel abgeben und uns abmelden.

    Eine andere Schule in unserem Bezirk hatte ein Deutschprogramm. Der Lehrer geht dieses Jahr in den Ruhestand, und anscheinend werden sie nächstes Jahr kein Deutsch anbieten. Ich sprach mit unserer Schülerberaterin, weil es sein könnte, dass Schüler zu uns kommen wollen. Sie sagte, "Bitte, lassen Sie mich wissen, bevor Sie so etwas machen. Dann können wir das Programm stufenweise abbauen, anstatt auf einmal." Wie bitte?! Abbauen? Nicht, "einen anderen Lehrer finden"?! Mir scheint's, dass die Verwaltung hier nur Spanisch unterstützt - Französisch hatte schon vor zwei Jahren Probleme und hat sie Gott sei Dank überwunden. Wenn ich das Lehramt aufgebe, wird Deutsch dran sein. *seufz* Ich muss planen . . . (bin eigentlich schon dabei - buahahaha [böses Lachen]).

    In Duluth gab es riesige Überschwemmungen. Zwei Robben und ein Eisbär sind aus dem Zoo gekommen. Der Eisbär hatte Zuflucht auf einer Mauer genommen, die zwei Robben fanden sie auf der Straße. Leider sind andere Tiere gestorben. Hier in Südkalifornien ist das Wetter schön; es gibt eine leichte Brise, die Sonne scheint, es ist um 23 Grad (Celsius). Ich sitze an einem Tisch bei Starbuck's und lese LEO. Na ja, Arbeitslosigkeit hat doch ihre Vorteile. :-)

    Edit: Oder heißt das jetzt "seine Vorteile"? :-p
    #173AuthorRobert -- US (328606) 22 Jun 12, 01:54
    Comment
    I find it a little difficult to reconcile the rejoicing of teachers (#153) with seasonal unemployment. However, the US system may be organized in a way allowing to get along with this seasonal change. And a system like this may promote mobility of teachers and their ideas among schools, so, there may be advantages, too.
    Not being (thank you, Lara Chu) a teacher myself, I understand that there is a two-class system in German schools, with part of the teachers being permanently employed and another fraction hired and fired seasonally. I don't think this is acceptable.

    I should have loved to think more about hm -- us's "suffer fools gladly", but I did not have the time yet.

    Last night, I saw the first firefly this year and (quoting Duluth's Robert Zimmermann) in the drizzlin' rain.
    #174AuthorEmil 14 (299747) 22 Jun 12, 03:37
    Comment
    Random corrections:
    Amy: Und da meine Schwester drei Buben hat (Zwillinge und deren not ihren Bruder, der knapp 18 Monate älter ist), (and didn't you say somewhere in this CC or the previous one that your German is more Northern than Southern?)
    Lara: Kiefern
    Nicht mehr lange, dann ist not gibt's Feierabend.
    Hm:
    Neuen kleinen Neffen (never thought about it, but I have never heard Neffchen, Nefflein or other dimunitives)

    Lara, you may want to re-think the PM idea in a translation agency. You might not be anymore the slave of the PM, but you will be the slave of the client. Not great either, to put it nicely.
    No rain or thunderstorms here, but we had a lot of clouds today - after a few days in the high 80s.
    #175AuthorDixie (426973) 22 Jun 12, 06:42
    Comment
    Na ja, Arbeitslosigkeit hat doch ihre Vorteile. Make it simple, Robert: Na ja, Arbeitslosigkeit hat auch Vorteile.
    #176Authorbluesky (236159) 22 Jun 12, 11:40
    Comment
    @Dixie: Danke für die Korrekturen. Mit ihren/deren habe ich neulich zwei Fehler gemacht, da muss ich besser aufpassen. Und ja, dass mit Buben war gewusst, würde ich eigentlich nie sagen, nur schreiben, und dann nur um bluesky und co. eine Freude zu machen. Hoffentlich hat's hingehauen.

    *Emil zitier* I find it a little difficult to reconcile the rejoicing of teachers (#153) with seasonal unemployment. 

    Ich auch.

    @Robert: Ich finde, wenn ihr wisst, dass ihr ab September wieder eine Stelle habt, dann seid ihr nicht arbeitslos. Ist es so wichtig, ob ihr den Gehalt in 9 Monaten oder über 12 Monaten geteilt bekommt? Das Thema haben wir aber sicher schon diskutiert. Ich muss aber sagen, dass heutzutage solche Sachen in Michigan eher unwichtig scheinen, da wir eigentlich Sorgen um den Kollektivvertrag und die Gewerkschaft machen. Wisconsin ist ganz nah und die selben Provokateure sind in Michigan tätig. Sie würden allzu gerne das öffentliche Bildungssystem lahm legen, und ich übertreibe nicht.

    Ein Praktikant an meiner Schule hatte sich um eine Stelle beworben und ein Interview gehabt. Eines Tages fragte ich ihn, ob er was gehört hatte. Er darauf, nein, aber eigentlich wollte er die Stelle nicht. Warum? Das Schulbehörde bietet keine Krankheitstage an, auch kein Ruhestandsgeld und eigentlich keinen Vertrag. Die Charterschulen lassen grüßen. Es ist bekannt, dass Lehrer in Charterschulen von heute auf morgen gefeuert werden können. Ohne Grund. Inzwischen haben wir ein solches Gesetz, das auch auf alle öffentliche Schulen in Michigan zutrifft. Ab diesem Jahr kann ich meine Stelle aus irgendeinem Grund verlieren, solange er nicht kapriziös ist. Die Abgeordnete arbeiten auch dran, das ganze Rentensystem der Behördenbediensteten abzubauen.

    @harambee: Von Ravelympics und dem Streit hatte ich nicht gehört, bevor du die Links zu der Geschichte einfügtest. Was ich interessant und eigentlich schade finde, ist Folgendes: She explains that trademark holders have to go after everyone who violates their intellectual property or they lose the right to go after anyone. Mehr Geld für die Anwälte.

    @Sachs: Man muss sich die Wörter schon merken. Das scheint mir nicht gerade einfach zu sein. Falls man aber einen Fehler macht, ist der Satz meistens noch verständlich. He suggests to order lasagne. He suggests ordering lasagne. Na ja, letzterer Satz klingt nicht toll, aber man würde ihn problemlos verstehen.

    #177AuthorAmy-MiMi (236989) 22 Jun 12, 15:08
    Comment
    re "arbeitslos" und "sich freuen" und "Sache Schule": Ich weiß, dass ich es gut habe. Wir wissen aber auch, dass Worte wichtig sind, und ich bin eigentlich nicht in Urlaub. Mein Vertrag ist jedes Jahr von September bis Juni, egal ob ich 9, 10 oder 12 Mal im Jahr das Gehalt bekomme. Trotzdem freue ich mich, eine "Lehrpause" einlegen zu können. In anderen Staaten ist die Lage viel schlimmer, aber das ändert die Tatsachen hier nicht. (Sehr oft ist ein "Gegenargument" eine Relativierung - klage nicht, weil es anderswo schlimmer ist. Ich finde diese Sorte von Argumentieren nicht überzeugend. "Klage nicht, dass ich deinen Arm abgeschlagen habe; andere Leute haben auch kein Bein." - nicht das ich denke, Amy hätte so argumentiert oder argumentieren wollen.)

    Eine Frage über die Sprache, wenn jemand da ist. Was ist der Unterschied zwischen
    -er wurde nochmals rot
    -er wurde wieder rot
    (wenn es einem peinlich ist)
    #178AuthorRobert -- US (328606) 22 Jun 12, 20:02
    Comment
    Robert:

    not much of a difference.

    -er wurde nochmals rot - again, he blushed
    -er wurde wieder rot - he blushed once more
    #179Authorpenguin (236245) 22 Jun 12, 20:24
    Comment
    I'm still trying to work out what you're talking about. Forgive me if I'm being naive, but are you saying that in the US, teachers are umemployed during the summer break and it's up to them how they get by? (that last bit rings a bell; didn't Amy write about this a while back? But even then it wasn't clear to me that this is standard)

    Robert, ich würde auch 'hat ihre Vorteile' sagen.

    I don't see any difference in meaning between 'nochmals' and 'wieder' but in register. 'nochmals' is very much 'Schriftdeutsch' IMO and doesn't really go with 'rotwerden' very well. I'd expect 'erröten' or something similar.

    Edit: Hi, penguin. *waving*
    #180AuthorGibson (418762) 22 Jun 12, 20:24
    Comment
    @Robert: Vielleicht wollte ich doch ein bisschen so argumentieren. ;-) Musst du dich jedes Jahr um "deine" Stelle bewerben?
    #181AuthorAmy-MiMi (236989) 22 Jun 12, 20:27
    Comment
    *waving back at Gibson*
    #182Authorpenguin (236245) 22 Jun 12, 20:33
    Comment
    I just realised that there's a whole sentence missing im #180, whithout which (?) the bit in brackets makes no sense:

    ...and it's up to them how they get by? And that you don't know if you still have a job come autumn? (That last bit...)
    #183AuthorGibson (418762) 22 Jun 12, 20:41
    Comment
    Stichwort hier ist wahrscheinlich tenure, das vielleicht grob mit 'verbeamtet sein' vergleichbar wäre, ohne das Staatsbürgerschaftserfordernis (?)), aber wenigstens was benefits betrifft (alles über das eigentliche Gehalt: Krankenversicherung, Rentenanspruch, Urlaub, Sicherheit des Arbeitsplatzes usw.). Wenn man tenure hat, hat man die Stelle als Lehrer bis die Rente. Das ist ein Gerecht, das, wenn ich es richtig verstehe, in früheren Jahrzehnten meist nicht gesetzlich, sondern durch Gewerkschaftsverträge garantiert wurde. Aber jetzt haben viele Städte (= Schulbezirke) nicht genug Geld, um ihre Rentenversprechen zu halten, die teilweise durchaus großzügiger waren (volle Krankenversicherung, Pensionsalter manchmal um die 62, 63), als das jetzt typische 401(k)-Plan im privater Sektor (nur Investmentfonds und man darf selber sehen, wie man damit klarkommt).

    Wie Amy habe ich den Eindruck, dass es sich durchaus um einen organisierten Angriff auf den Begriff der öffentlichen Bildung handelt, und das finde ich auch traurig. Soll die Tea-Party-Fraktion ihre Kinder ja im nächstbilligsten Strip-Mall bilden lassen, oder in einer vermeintlich 'christlichen' Schule *graus*, die Werte und Wissenschaft noch wie im Mittelalter lehrt, und dann verblöden sie sich nur noch mehr und hören nur noch weiterhin Talk-Radio -- na, wenn sie meinen. Aber was passiert, wenn wir eigentlich eine gutgebildete Generation brauchen, um in der Welt noch wettbewerbsfähig zu sein und unsere Generation im Alter zu versorgen? Davon ganz zu schweigen, intelligent, weltoffen und gut informiert zu sein und sich nicht von Demagogen in Krieg und Hass führen zu lassen ...

    Entschuldigung, hoffentlich ist es nur die Atmosphäre hier in diesem nach wie vor blutroten bzw. saublöden US-Bundesstaat und es sieht in den sogenannten swing states nicht so schlimm aus. Aber ich habe für die Wahl im November wirklich kein gutes Gefühl. Es sei denn, es gibt unter den Latinos plötzlich viel mehr Wahlbeteiligung als üblich, aber ich fürchte, das ist wohl zu viel gefragt.
    #184Authorhm -- us (236141) 22 Jun 12, 21:32
    Comment
    Is everyone out in the sun? Or enjoying the weekend?
    #185AuthorDixie (426973) 24 Jun 12, 02:12
    Comment
    @#184 hm--us: Darf ich fragen, in welchem Staat du lebst?

    Es scheint für mich als USA-Besucher nicht nur eine Frage des Staates zu sein, sondern auch des Bildungsstandes und auch der Zugehörigkeit zu bestimmten Gruppierungen.
    #186Authorwaltherwithh (554696) 24 Jun 12, 04:45
    Comment
    Hi waltherwithh!
    (I like your nick)

    A so far silent reader; welcome to the open Crossover Chat! ;-)

    I'm curious - are you a kind of permanent visitor or just on a trip?
    And, the idea in here is to write in the non-mothertongue (see #1).

    Another (unwritten) rule is that newcomers share their shoe size and credit card number and, if they wish, other bits of information.... ;-)

    #187AuthorGoldammer (428405) 24 Jun 12, 07:53
    Comment
    I stumbled into this thread a little while ago and like the general discussions on many different subjects.
    Shoesize? Depends very much on the type and brand of shoes, I have everything between 11 1/2 to 13 :-)

    I am a visitor (3 or 4 weeks) to the USA since 1998 (once or twice a year), but learned the "basics" of my English at a public school in the UK; had to use it throughout my professional life. Now retired... I will probably never get rid of my German accent, but most of my friends like it.

    I have a lot of interests that is why I came here :-)
    #188Authorwaltherwithh (554696) 24 Jun 12, 14:26
    Comment
    Hallo, waltherwithh. Du hast immer noch vergessen, deine Kreditkartennummer einzugeben.

    *hust*

    *Goldammer wink*

    Korrektur für waltherwithh: I have been a visitor to the USA since 1998...klingt immer noch ein bisschen seltsam. Ich würde "I have been visiting the USA once or twice a year since 1998" vorziehen.

    @Dixie: Nein, ich bin zurzeit bei meinen Eltern in Iowa. Heute fahren wir zu einem Familientreffen.

    @Gibson: In Michigan wissen Lehrer normalerweise, dass sie im Herbst eine Stelle haben. Neue Lehrer müssen manchmal eine Zeitlang arbeiten, bevor sie eine feste Stelle bekommen. Ich habe Glück gehabt, indem ich arbeite, aber Pech gehabt, indem ich jeden Sommer auf der Suche nach einem Job bin. Es gibt aber andere Neulehrer, die Glück hatten, und das nicht machen mussten.

    Ich habe mehr zum Thema tenure zu sagen, habe aber momentan keine Zeit. Vielleicht nachher.

    Ist hier übrigens eine fußballfreie Zone? Wenn nicht, ich habe Teile der Deutschland-Griechenland und Spanien-Frankreich Spiele angeschaut. Obwohl die Deutschen und Griechen brav 6 Tore erzielten, schaffte ich es, nur zwei davon live zu sehen. Minutenlang machten die Jungs nichts, und gerade als ich in die Küche ging (ich bereitete das Abendessen zu) haben sie geschossen. Ärgerlich!
    #189AuthorAmy-MiMi (236989) 24 Jun 12, 14:54
    Comment
    Concerning credit card numbers: That is almost American style for me as I own several beginning with #1234 5678 9012 :-)

    I saw some of the soccer matches during my actually ongoing visit to Florida and will try to see England vs Italy this afternoon, want to know the next opponent for Germany :-)

    I thought about the "ing-construction" for "visiting"; the idea with "visitor" was that I wanted to make clear that I am not living here permanently or with a visa which is sometimes complicated for Europeans who want to stay longer than 6 months.
    I do not know if there are similar restrictions for US-citizens visiting Europe.

    @Amy-MiMi: klitzekleine Verbesserung...
    In Michigan wissen Lehrer normalerweise, dass sie im Herbst eine Stelle haben.
    In Michigan wissen Lehrer normalerweise, ob sie im Herbst eine Stelle haben (werden).
    Without "werden" it would be more colloquial, with "werden" it uses the correct Futur.
    #190Authorwaltherwithh (554696) 24 Jun 12, 15:14
    Comment
    That's what makes football so unattractive, Amy-MiMi: There are very few highlights randomly scattered among lengthy periods of boring destruction.

    Germany's next opponent will be in tomorrow's newspaper ...
    ... but I will have a look, too, tonight. I like watching Wayne Rooney play.
    #191AuthorEmil 14 (299747) 24 Jun 12, 15:54
    Comment
    Hi, walther, willkommen im CC und in den USA. Du könntest auch sagen:

    I come to the US (on vacation/on business) every year.
    I spend a couple of weeks a year in the US.
    I'm a frequent/regular visitor to the US.
    I've been visiting the US once or twice a year (ever) since 1998.
    I'm familiar with the US because I come a couple of times a year.


    usw.

    Du bist also derzeit in Florida? Viel Spaß weiterhin, falls du dich dort auf Urlaub oder was auch immer befindest. Magst du denn Wassersport oder spielst du etwa gerne Golf oder Tennis, oder bist ein Disney-Fan, oder kaufst du vielleicht gerne Eigentumswohnungen, oder wieso hat es dich gerade nach Florida geschlagen? Reisest du immer wieder dorthin oder besuchst du auch manchmal andere US-Staaten? Da du gefragt hast: ich lebe in einem eher zentraler gelegten Südstaaten, mit langweiligeren Stränden aber dafür besserem BBQ und mexikanischem Essen. Und vergleichbar viel Spanisch, aber anders; vielleicht nicht so snobistisch (sprich: konservativ-kubanisch).

    Deutschland-Griechenland habe ich im Radio über einen ziemlich kratzigen (knisternden? knarzenden? related discussion: staticky - elektrostatisch ) spanischen AM-Sender gehört. Ich hätte wohl zu Freunden mit ESPN (von denen alle aber selbst eher selten Sport schauen, und so gut wie nie Fußball) oder in ein Sportlokal (allein) gehen können, aber für dieses Spiel wenigstens war das keine so anlockende Vorstellung. Mal sehen, wann das nächste Deutschlandspiel ist.

    Heute morgen habe ich im Radio eine interessante Sendung über China gehört. Bei 'This American Life', aber die ganze Stunde war ein Bericht von einem Reporter für die New-Yorker-Zeitschrift, Evan Otsos, Olmos, so in der Richtung. Einer der Unterschiede sei, dass es in China immer noch viele Kleinbauer auf dem Land gibt, auch wenn große Landwirtschaftsfirmen jetzt vielleicht Anstalten machen, sie in die Städte zu treiben zu versuchen. Der Kontrast zu den USA war auffallend: hier sollen jetzt weniger als 1 % auf einer Farm wohnen, so dass die Frage nicht mal noch in der Volkszählung steht. Da musste ich an Amys Eltern (und ihren Bruder?) denken.

    Emil, welches glaubst du kommt also schneller voran, dein Traum von mehr Basketball in Europa oder meiner von mehr Fußball in den USA? Ich fürchte, du hast schon einen erheblicher Vorsprung ...

    Dixie, warst du also selber draußen in der Sonne, und wenn, hast du das Wochenende (bisher) genossen? (-:
    #192Authorhm -- us (236141) 24 Jun 12, 20:39
    Comment
    ...nach Florida (ge)verschlagen...

    ...hast du einen erheblichen Vorsprung...

    (just very shortly, during half time in the Italy-England match)
    #193AuthorGoldammer (428405) 24 Jun 12, 21:46
    Comment
    Danke. Der zweite war wohl nur ein Edit-Fehler.

    just very shortly (= bald, in Kürze) —> briefly (= kurz)


    Ich habe das Radio an, höre aber nicht sehr aufmerksam zu und mache gleichzeitig noch ein paar Sachen.

    Wie z.B. den Nektarspender auswaschen und wieder auffüllen, da ein Kolibri gerade unter den Blumen gesichtet wurde. Dieses Jahr ist aus irgendwelchem Grund kaum einer zum Spender gekommen, was das Ding irgendwie schneller dreckig zu machen scheint, und dann wollen sie wahrscheinlich erst recht nicht davon trinken. Wir fragen uns, ob die Dürre letzten Sommer so viele entweder umgebracht oder von dieser Gegend abschreckt haben könnte. Ich vermisse sie ... *schnief*
    #194Authorhm -- us (236141) 24 Jun 12, 22:24
    Comment
    I was a bit doubtful about "shortly", but didn't have the time to think much about it.
    Wow, that was an exciting match! Although Italy is the stronger opponent for us in the semi-final, I find they deserved their victory.

    (I hope none of my co-snails find it all too awful that we can't keep the CC completely soccer-free....but things being as they are, there will be a bit more of it towards the end of next week...)
    #195AuthorGoldammer (428405) 24 Jun 12, 23:36
    Comment
    Main purpose of my visits is visiting friends; Gulfcoast and Fort Lauderdale area but the second visit leads me to California. I like to explore some landscape (hopefully it will not continue to rain like it does today but DEBBIE is still around).
    Want to go to South Beach for the architecture tomorrow and hope to make it into the Everglades on Tuesday, perhaps some shopping at Sawgrass Mall on the way back from alligator alley.
    Wednesday on ESPN at 2:30pm Spain vs Portugal, I just hope for a good match
    Thursday same time Germany vs Italy. I think that the German team has the force to beat Italy, they were not that much stronger today, but England had a lot of problems to switch from defense to offense (for AE c instead of s).
    I will see the final at home in front of my own TV but probably without sound as I simply hate most of the comments.
    #196Authorwaltherwithh (554696) 25 Jun 12, 00:00
    Comment
    hm -- us
    There is only Bundesliga basketball on free tv in Germany, not a second of NBA games.

    I wonder whether there is absolutely no possibility to watch the Euro games via the internet. You can view today's game here:
    http://www.sportschau.de/
    Does anybody know whether they (or the ZDF, when it is their turn) have a livestream?

    edit: I agree with Goldammer - Italy deserved to reach the semi-finals.
    edit: http://www.sportschau.de/uefaeuro2012/euro201...
    #197AuthorEmil 14 (299747) 25 Jun 12, 00:24
    Comment
    There's geofencing around European TV for the EM, so we cannot watch it here. (I tried the other day as ESPN did not offer the greatest reception). Anyway, you can watch ESPN (with a rather grainy picture) on the Internet.
    I was a little bit outside yesterday and just came home after 1 hr on the beach (reading the papers, with an interesting article about Medicaid financed weight-loss surgery in Texas). Beautiful day with sunshine and a cool breeze. Just got half the beach on my feet which is a bit of a nuisance :)

    On the "teacher employment discussion": it's one of the things that always astonish me when it comes up withe people here, the difference in pay for teachers and also their job security. (Well, truthfully, it is right behind the health care discussion - which up to today I did not manage to really explain to a German up to now. Somehow the systems are so different - if you have not seen - and lived with - the US one, it is really hard to understand).
    #198AuthorDixie (426973) 25 Jun 12, 00:52
    Comment
    Geofencing - stupid me!
    I am always so naive.
    #199AuthorEmil 14 (299747) 25 Jun 12, 02:46
    Comment
    A belated thanks for the "Kiefern", Lara, that makes sense.

    At least you were kind enough to spare the soccer discussion till the Viertelfinale, so all of the soccer uninterested amongst us (like me) have to suffer only one more week of reports ;-)

    Welcome to the CC, Walther.
    #200AuthorSachs (638558) 25 Jun 12, 07:21
    Comment
    Only three days, Sachs, only three days! There are only three more matches to come, the semi-finals on Wednesday and Thursday and the final on Sunday.
    (And, looking up the exact dates, I just realized that Germany's next match is during a two days buisness trip I'll have next week - rats. I might be able to watch, but I might set priorities and spend the evening with my colleagues instead.)
    #201AuthorGoldammer (428405) 25 Jun 12, 07:38
    Comment
    #201 if they are good colleagues they will watch with you ..

    Lisa the cat likes to help me work, preferably by walking over the keyboard. Apart from destroying the document I am working on I once had the computer freeze up on me - I had to do a "hard boot". The most interesting result so far was when the screen contents turned upside down ..
    #202Authorleo029 (14476) 25 Jun 12, 13:28
    Comment
    Hallo zusammen,

    Leider bin ich wieder auf der Arbeit und nicht mit meinem Neffen. Vielleicht ist meine Meinung etwas einseitig, aber ich glaube, er ist das süßeste Baby überhaupt. Meine Schwester sieht gut aus--nur etwas ermüdet. Sie hat aber einen richtig guten Mann geheiratet. Er hat unglaublich viel Geduld und tut viel für sie.

    Zur Zeit hat der Kleine große blaue Augen und feines blondes Haar. Es bleibt wahrscheinlich nicht so. Mein Schwager ist von italienischer Abstammung, mit braunem Haar und braunen Augen. In unserer Familie sind alle aber blau- und grünäugig. Meine Mutter findet, der Kleine hat einen ähnlichen Teint wie ich (auf Englisch: she thinks he has the same coloring as I do/did as a baby), und ist fest davon überzeugt, dass er ein Rothaariger mit blauen oder grünen Augen sein wird. Mal sehen!

    Am Freitag hatten wir schlimme Stürme mit viel Donner und Blitzen (Santas anderen Rentiere haben uns nicht besucht ;o)). Dies führte zu einem Brand in einem Luftraumkontrollzentrum und alle Flüge in unserer Gegend (anreisend und abreisend) wurden gestoppt. Wir haben 5 Stunden gewartet und sind dann endlich um 3 Uhr morgens bei meiner Schwester angekommen. Der ganze Ärger hat sich aber gelohnt :o)

    Ich freue mich schon auf das Spiel am Donnerstag. Habe ich schon erzählt, dass mein bester Freund gebürtiger Italiener ist? Das wird ein Spaß sein ;o)
    #203AuthorLara Chu (AmE) (236716) 25 Jun 12, 16:08
    Comment
    @Lara:
    - Santas andere (anderen) Rentiere
    - I would suggest "mit viel Blitz und (Ge)donner" (mit viel Donner und Blitzen)
    - sämtliche (alle) - it's not really a mistake, but it sounds better :)
    - Das wird ein Spaß (sein)!

    Many things have happened since my last visit in this shell.
    My host mother has finally come to the conclusion that her son is addicted to video games - and that only because his marks are getting worse.
    The boy, however, is confident about his marks - he has reached the full score in the last spelling test.
    The result is treacherous. It only means that he has managed to learn the spelling of a given list of words, but when it comes to the most basic words - the ones I'm teaching him in our German lessons - he still makes a lot of (I'd rather say "too many") mistakes.
    He had a 4-day break from the Playstation, but now, everything's like before.

    I blame both the mother and the father for those circumstances; the mother keeps buying the boys everything they want, while the father infects them with the glorification of war and violence (he is a WW2 freak).
    They should give the boys more limits, I think.
    I would gladly enforce any rules given by the mother, but as she doesn't talk to me about it, I cannot do anything.
    She has to comprehend the seriosity of the situation first.

    On Saturday, I took part in the Swedish picnic in Hyde Park - I have never seen so many blonde people in one place, not to mention beautiful girls :D
    I used the opportunity to listen to their conversations and I was quite happy to recognize some of the words I had already learnt.

    There's only one month left - and I don't want to go back to Germany. :(
    Over the past few weeks, I got to know many new people - and came closer to some I met quite a long time ago.
    Some of them will go to or are already in Italy or France, as au pairs.
    And since that fateful picnic on Saturday, I feel the overwhelming desire to fully learn the Swedish language and to travel there.
    In Germany, only studies await me. And I can't just take a break from them - otherwise, I will have to relearn all I have forgotten in the meantime.
    That means that no matter what I do, I will be bound to stay in Germany for a couple of years.
    I will never be this young again, I should have the time of my life now - but at the same time, I struggle to keep up with my parents' expectations.
    I don't know what to do.
    I simply don't know.
    No idea how I can escape from this dilemma.
    #204AuthorThonatas (821337) 25 Jun 12, 17:49
    Comment
    "ich glaube, er ist das süßeste Baby überhaupt"

    Not that I would dare to doubt that, Lara. I just wonder: How can all these sweet, lovely, angellike babies grow into all these almost unbearable devils of teenagers ? ;-)

    Had to buy a new TV set today after my old CRT TV started to hum really loud whenever it was on for half an hour or so. It really wasn't a pleasure to watch any more, particularly not any music. Meanwhile all devices are attached again and it works properly.
    #205AuthorSachs (638558) 26 Jun 12, 00:28
    Comment
    Which brand (or at least type) of TV did you buy, Sachs? A huge one?
    Is it attached to some surround sound and why did you not have a check WHY it was making humming noises? Not worth a repair anymore?

    I would not like to replace my Sony TV at the moment as it has an excellent picture though I have seen recently some Samsung Flatscreen which were nice and of course less heavy.

    I hope nobody is bothered about mentioning brands.
    #206Authorwaltherwithh (554696) 26 Jun 12, 04:13
    Comment
    Is there still any (financial) advantage in having tv repaired? I have to say I never had a tv long enough for breaking, but I always thought that the repair cost would be much higher than a new tv. (But maybe that is because I only have a 30" flatscreen, so it is not really expensive and a new tv is cheaper if needed)
    Thonatas - not sure why you cannot have both - study and have fun? Maybe I missed what you are going to study, but unless you want to finish your studies in record time, there is plenty of time to have fun and enjoy yourself (and you should study for yourself not your parents, but that is really your decision). I studied, worked and still had plenty of fun (I also had plenty of fun before I decided to study :)). You'll be astonished how much time you'll have - and you'll be even more astonished when you have finished your studies and look back at the time and realise HOW MUCH time you had. So, go, study, enjoy yourself. And have lots of fun. You'll never be as carefree as you are before you turn - what 25, 30 ?
    #207AuthorDixie (426973) 26 Jun 12, 06:46
    Comment
    ehm, Dixie, may I ask how long ago and what you studied? My impression is that nowadays, especially since they turned the whole university system to Bachelor and Masters courses, students don't nearly have as much leisure time as in our good ol' student days. They sometimes have to use all the semester breaks to learn for tests etc, and they have terribly full schedules during the semesters. I have also heard that in many courses, learning is really stupid - you have to reproduce huge amounts of facts and knowledge for the tests so the only possible way of doing it is "bulimia learning" - learn stuff until just before your brain explodes, then "vomit" it in the test and afterwards forget it immediately.
    I don't know if this is true for all students and courses, but I have heard it a few times during the past few years.
    #208AuthorGoldammer (428405) 26 Jun 12, 07:47
    Comment
    Well, the brand, to avoid naming it, should say how the picture is ("scharf"). It's a 40 inch LED Quattron flat screen, so it's considerable bigger than my previous set was (about 28 inch). I don't think that a repair would have been of any use. It was over 10 years old, so repairing one part of it (I guess it was a defective tube) might have extended its span of life for a few more months - IF there is someone who still repairs it (unless you know some amateur) - till probably the next part would have failed. There's a satellite receiver (there would be a built-in as well, but it made the attaching easier, at least till I have more time, to use the external device), two video recorders and two dvd recorders attached, but in a linear connection so there hadn't been any major changes necessary. No surround sound equipment yet. I'm still in doubt how good they are. Some friends are not so happy with, because they think the additional sound only highlights that part of the sound you do not necessarily need, the background noise, so it gets more difficult to understand the spoken texts. Also it might not be the best investment in a flat house, where you have to listen / watch at low volume most of the time.

    Ok, should start working. Have a nice day everyone.
    #209AuthorSachs (638558) 26 Jun 12, 07:58
    Comment
    @#209
    I get the idea, Sachs. For a 10 year old equipment it would probably not have made sense.

    I wonder about your expression "flat house", I would like to know about the opinion of other people how they call an apartment building or a house with several condominiums in it. Reading "flat house" let me think of a one level building.
    #210Authorwaltherwithh (554696) 26 Jun 12, 13:18
    Comment
    related discussion: Dancing around the world

    Der Link verschwindet unter der Rubrik Land und Leute, wo andere Themen diskutiert werden. Aber das von mir zugelinkte Video hat mir wirklich gut gefallen, also versuche ich es hier. Das Video habe ich im SPON gefunden.

    Ich stimme Walther zu. Ein flat house, klingt zu sehr nach flaches Haus. Wir AEler sagen selten flat, also würde ich apartment building vorschlagen, aber das ist wahrscheinlich zu AE. Warum nicht einfach flat?

    Korrektürchen:

    für Sachs (#209): considerably bigger...have extended its life span...so no major changes had been necessary...I still question how good they are (I'm still unsure how good)...gets more difficult to understand the dialogue...(#205) angelic babies

    für Walther (#210): for (a) ten-year-old equipment...Reading flat house made me think of...(#206) not worth repairing anymore...

    für Goldammer (#208): don't have nearly as much (Wortstellung)...knowledge for the tests, so...vomit it on the test...(Das Wortbild ist so schlimmer, finde ich, aber auf jeden Fall klingt "in the test" zu Denglisch, auch möglich und wahrscheinlicher wäre "regurgitate it on the test")

    für Dixie (#207): long enough for it to break...

    *Tee trinken geh*

    für Thonatas: seriostity gibt es nicht. Besser wäre seriousness.
    #211AuthorAmy-MiMi (236989) 26 Jun 12, 14:44
    Comment
    Ich finde "Bulimie testing" und "vomit on the test" genial. Das beschreibt viel zu viele Kurse in der High School auch.

    Willkommen im CC, Waltherwithh.

    Zur Zeit bin ich an einer Lehrerkonferenz, und die nächste Präsentation beginnt in wenigen Minuten.

    *Schokolade hinterlassen*
    #212AuthorRobert -- US (328606) 26 Jun 12, 16:33
    Comment
    Ich finde "Bulimia testing" und "vomit on the test" genial. Das beschreibt viel zu viele Kurse in der High School auch.

    Willkommen im CC, Waltherwithh.

    Zur Zeit bin ich an einer Lehrerkonferenz, und die nächste Präsentation beginnt in wenigen Minuten.

    *Schokolade hinterlassen*
    #213AuthorRobert -- US (328606) 26 Jun 12, 16:34
    Comment
    Even if you post it twice, Robert, you are still

    in einer Lehrerkonferenz
     

    ;-)
    #214AuthorGoldammer (428405) 26 Jun 12, 17:37
    Comment
    @Robert: I know it's tricky (even for Germans!), but zurzeit (zur Zeit) is the correct form. :)
    #215AuthorThonatas (821337) 26 Jun 12, 17:55
    Comment
    Ah, Thonatas, you are post-spelling-reform age, aren't you? I won't ever learn this one, and I personally refuse to use it in my own texts, but Robert being a German teacher, your correcturito is important of course.
    #216AuthorGoldammer (428405) 26 Jun 12, 18:05
    Comment
    Danke für die 'Türchen. Entschuldigt, bitte, das Doppelposten - es war ein Problem mit der Internet-Verbindung.

    Ich lernte Deutsch auch vor der Reform, und die Veränderungen wie "zur Zeit" --> "zurzeit" sind mir immer noch problematisch. Zurzeit ist zurzeit richtig, aber zur Zeit meines Studiums war zur Zeit richtig. *seufz*
    #217AuthorRobert -- US (328606) 26 Jun 12, 18:33
    Comment
    Sachs' 'flat house' reminds me of one of my student's 'flat cat' ;)

    zurzeit looks very odd to me, too. I guess I'll be around 90 by the time I've made peace with the spelling reform (?). Stupid, stupid thing... it didn't even make anything easier or more logical (apart from 'dass', I'll give them that one. But that's one.))

    My short and not very sweet advice for Thonatas: sod* your parents expectations. It's your life and all that. You're not sixteen anymore (are you?), so it's not really anything to do with them.
    But then, I'm not that clear about your problem, actually. You're in England as an au pair, right? Aren't you doing exactly what lots of young people dream of doing, i.e. spending some time in a different country having fun? So what's the dilemma? You want more fun? Finish your studies (if you're half-way through, it can't be that much longer to go) and go work in Sweden, or wherever you want to be then. Enjoying life does not, as a rule, stop when you turn thirty.

    * is that inoffensive enough? I was looking for something mild but colloquial, and 'Oh, sod it. Let's just do it.' is not particularly strong language in BE IMO. But sometimes it's hard to judge.

    Lara, I know quite a few really beautiful red-haired women, but I'm not sure I'd wish that kind of colouring on a man. I think he'd be better off with his father's genes. Tall, dark and handsome and all that. (well, tall might be a problem... Maybe a mix of both of them?)
    #218AuthorGibson (418762) 26 Jun 12, 19:01
    Comment
    Thonatas: gibt es denn keine Gelegenheit, dein Studium für ein Semester nach Schweden umzusiedeln? Einige Freunde von mir an meiner deutschen Uni haben ein Semester im Ausland verbracht. Oder bist du an der FH? Ich kannte jemand, der sein Praxissemester in Schweden gemacht hatte. Es braucht nur viel Vorbereitung und Planung, sollte aber eigentlich kein Problem sein.

    Gibson: Stimmt. ;o)
    #219AuthorLara Chu (AmE) (236716) 26 Jun 12, 19:21
    Comment
    Es kommt darauf an Gibson. Tall dark and handsome? Stehst du etwa auf Typen wie Antonio Banderas? Ich hatte immer ein Faible für Männer mit rotem Haar. Mein erster Schwarm war der Rotschopf Steve E. (nicht unser Steve) in der ersten Klasse. Und danach gab's andere Schwärme mit rotem (und einer mit rotblondem) Haar. Es stimmt aber, dass das Aussehen nicht am wichtigsten ist, und deshalb sollte es keinen überraschen, dass Herr MiMi keine rote Haare hat, ich ihn aber trotzdem attraktiv finde. *gg*

    Für mich ist "sod" total inoffensiv, denn ich denke dabei erst an *nachschlag* Grassode.

    zurzeit sieht in der Tat blöd aus, aber ich habe mich mit der Schlechtschreibreform abgefunden, und das Wort richtig in #189 geschrieben, musste es aber vorher nachschlagen um sicherzugehen. Wie Gibson finde ich die dass-Regel in Ordnung, überhaupt die ß-ss-Regeln finde ich gut, selbst wenn sie unserer SD3 unbeliebt sind.

    Meine Lieblingsfeinde der Rechtschreibreform sind leid tun und recht haben, da ich durch die Reform der Reform total verunsichert wurde.

    @Goldammer: Ich finde pet hate/pet peeve ist so ein Wort, das der deutschen Sprache fehlt. Führen wir eine Liste?
    #220AuthorAmy-MiMi (236989) 26 Jun 12, 19:33
    Comment
    Stehst du etwa auf Typen wie Antonio Banderas?

    No, that's too much of the Latin Lover. I'd like a kind of Lego kit, please: this guy's hair, that guy's cheekbones, this guy's body, that guy's eyes. I'm not sure Build-Yourself-You-Dream-Man comes with a character, though. That might be extra.
    #221AuthorGibson (418762) 26 Jun 12, 19:57
    Comment
    Wo sind meine Manieren? Willkommen im CC, waltherwithh.

    Ich habe heute keeeeine Lust auf Arbeiten. Nur noch 3 volle Tage, dann habe ich einen kleinen Urlaub. Ich wünsche, ich könnte irgendwo hinfahren, wo ich in Ruhe lesen kann, mit schöner Landschaft. Hmm vielleicht sollte ich ein bißchen recherchieren.
    #222AuthorLara Chu (AmE) (236716) 26 Jun 12, 20:32
    Comment
    @Robert: Ich (lernte) habe (Deutsch) vor der R.-Reform Deutsch gelernt
    (You'll maybe know the reason better than I do, to me it's a gut feeling)

    @Amy-MiMi: Your are right, "pet peeve" is missing in German. I think there was a thread once somewhere in Leo. AFAIK we don't have a list. Shall we make one?

    ...sollte es keinen überraschen, dass Herr MiMi keine roten Haare hat,...
    #223AuthorGoldammer (428405) 26 Jun 12, 21:19
    Comment
    Thonatas, du hast also schon eine Schwedin kennengelernt, oder sogar eine ganze Schar davon? Ts, ts, wie sagt man auf Deutsch 'fast mover'? Wir gratulieren ... *fg*

    Aber mal im Ernst: auf die Gefahr hin, selbst alt und spießig (elternlich? -haft?) rüberzukommen, würde ich eigentlich nicht sagen: Sch*** auf deine Eltern und ihre Erwartungen. Sie haben nunmal schon fast zwei Jahrzehnte für dein Wohl gearbeitet und gespart, vielleicht sogar geöpfert, und studieren ist ja auch aus anderen Gründen ratsam. Falls du schon genug Geld und Zeit hast, dir ein gap year zu nehmen, ginge das vielleicht auch -- wenn du einen guten Plan machst, was genau du damit erreichen (und hoffentlich auch dabei lernen) willst und nicht bloß ein ganzes Jahr lang, ähm, locker aushängen und Mädchen hinterherlaufen würdest. Das wäre eine Verschwendung sowohl deiner Talente als auch deiner Zeit. Und wie Lara sagt, kannst du wahrscheinlich einen Weg finden, Zeit in Schweden zu verbringen, auch wenn du studierst. Und wie Gibson sagt, du bist ja auch schon im Ausland und machst schon eine schöne Auszeit, und bleibst vielleicht sogar noch ein paar Monate, oder?

    Wenn das nicht eine (keine?) zu persönliche Frage ist, weißt du schon, welches Fach du studieren wirst? (Das muss man in D eigentlich schon entschieden haben, bevor man sich matrikuliert, nicht wahr, anders als hier?) Das könnte auch einen Unterschied machen, wenn der Lerninhalt im ersten Jahr sehr auf Vorkenntnissen ruht, wie z.B. in Mathe oder Naturwissenschaft. Du willst beim Lernen ja nicht zu sehr aus der Übung kommen, sonst könnte es dir nur schwerer fallen, wieder einzusteigen.

    Aber einige machen das schon und scheinen dabei Erfolg zu haben. Snowflake zum Beispiel, die hier im CC früher mal mitgemacht hat, hat glaube ich nach einem Auszeitsjahr an der Uni angefangen. Es scheint ihr jetzt bzw. noch gut zu gehen, oder so hoffe ich wenigstens -- auch wenn sie anscheinend in einem dieser Fächern ist, das viel Auswendiglernen verlangt.
    #224Authorhm -- us (236141) 26 Jun 12, 21:28
    Comment
    Hi, snails, everybody!

    I finally managed to get me a new account and join here again.

    Although I missed the last, like, thousand threads, I noticed you still stick to the CC traditions as I was used to. And I'm glad to read so many familiar names!

    So let me bid you my best compliments, especially those of you who might remember me ...

    #225AuthorWilli W. Winzig (872591) 26 Jun 12, 22:46
    Comment
    Hey, welcome back! I have been posting in the CC for more than 5 years, and I haven't ever met you there - only heard you mentioned a few times, I think. So, it's really been some time!
    I think you definitely must tell us your shoe size and credit card number once again! And maybe share a few more things if you want to for us who heven't met you!
    #226AuthorGoldammer (428405) 26 Jun 12, 23:13
    Comment
    Are typos worth to be mentioned? :-? (haven't)

    Florida is VERY wet at the moment, but the tour into the Everglades was interesting till it got to wet from above.
    Sawgrass Mills Mall (close to Ft Lauderdale) is huge but not always a bargain as one might expect when reading about "outlet". Some things stay still pricey...

    But it is good to be with friends and enjoy great bakery at "Cheesecake Factory" :-)

    Welcome to Willi Winzig! Are you a friend of Heinz Erhardts humour?
    #227Authorwaltherwithh (554696) 26 Jun 12, 23:26
    Comment
    Nice to meet you, WWW. We haven't met before, but after I read that even Goldammer hasn't I'm relieved that it isn't my memory but simply my too short presence here in the CC.

    Thanks for the corrections, Amy, and for the hint about "flat house". However, everyone understood that I didn't talk about a bungalow, even if it isn't standard English ;-)

    In return I've one to offer to you, Walther:
    ... till it got too wet.

    Good night, snails [kreepingintomyhouse]
    #228AuthorSachs (638558) 27 Jun 12, 00:13
    Comment
    I am ALWAYS having problems with "to" and "too".

    to is for me: zu (comparative sense?)

    too is: usuable like "also"(engl.) or "auch" (dt.)

    to many or too many? to hot or too hot? Any rule for that?
    #229Authorwaltherwithh (554696) 27 Jun 12, 00:25
    Comment
    @Willi: Schön, dass du wieder da bist! *zu mir* Bin ich wirklich so viel älter als Goldammer? *zu mir aus* Ich sehe, dass du immer noch klein bist, obwohl deine Zahl groß ist. 872 591. Respekt! *gg* Erzählst du ein bisschen aus deinem Leben?

    Are typos worth to be mentioned?

    Are typos worth mentioning (auch möglich: worthy of mention)?

    Normalerweise korrigieren wir Flüchtigkeitsfehler nicht, aber darin liegt eine Kunst, richtige Fehler von versehentlichen Lapsus zu unterscheiden. Es hilft, wenn man die Person ein bisschen kennt, denn so kann man das normale Sprachniveau besser einschätzen. Für gewöhnlich korrigieren wir nur Fehltritte in der eigenen Muttersprache, d.h. wenn ich einen Fehler auf Deutsch mache, übersehen hm--us, Robert und Lara das freundlicherweise und der Patzer wartet auf Sachs, Emil oder Goldammer oder...(hier sind so viele Deutschmuttersprachler, dass unsere Fehler entgehen fast nie den Adleraugen des Zimmers).

    *SD3 vermiss*

    @Goldammer: Wohin mit der Liste?

    Doorlet für Sachs: Everyone understood that I wasn't talking about a bungalow (hier brauchst du Verlaufsform, da die Handlung talking gleichzeitig mit einer anderen Handlung (understood) stattfindet.

    Zwei für Walther: enjoy a great bakery (oder great baked goods) at the Cheesecake Factory...und dann Erhardt's humour. Aber da hattest du wohl keinen Apostroph parat, da du dein Satzzeichen Sachs geschenkt hast.
    #230AuthorAmy-MiMi (236989) 27 Jun 12, 00:42
    Comment
    "..., dass unsere Fehler (entgehen) fast nie den Adleraugen des Zimmers entgehen" - Quite so.

    Hello, Walther and Willi!

    I returned from the Documenta at Kassel only two (sic!) hours or so ago.
    http://www.faz.net/aktuell/feuilleton/kunst/d...
    It is impossible to see every exhibition and every showcase there within one day, even if you are prepared to walk many, many miles. This is because there are so many venues scattered all over the city.
    We started early, but when we arrived in Kassel, it was less cloudy and even quite bright, so I forgot to switch off the headlights, and when we got back to the car, it would not move an inch. So, I had to find someone to give me a jump start, which was a very unlikely thing to happen on the nearly empty top floor of a multi-storey car park which was about to be closed within the next 15 minutes. But I was lucky ...
    #231AuthorEmil 14 (299747) 27 Jun 12, 02:04
    Comment
    Hello!

    Really strange that SD3 hadn't appeared for a pretty long time.

    But very nice that Willi Winzig is still alive! The founder of the Spanish Crossover Chat back in October 2006. Which seems to be in urgent need of reanimation.

    I'm more or less alive as well. Despite severe inundation with things to do. If everything goes well, I will be flying to Germany in a week. Which will most probably increase the inundation. Oh well.

    Good night!
    #232AuthorWachtelkönig (396690) 27 Jun 12, 04:24
    Comment
    He, waltherwithh. Viele Muttersprachler haben Schwierigkeiten mit two/too/to. Die Regeln sind aber gut verständlich, finde ich.

    Erstens two = zwei. Damit haben nur die Wenigsten Probleme.

    Wie du schon gemerkt hast, ist too = auch.
    too ist auch eine Steigerung (daher ein extra-O) von Adjektiven und Adverbien too busy, too hot, too quickly, too slowly (zu viel, zu heiß, zu langsam usw.)

    Dann gibt es to.
    To verwendet man mit Verben to play, to begin, to shop (zu + Infinitiv auf Deutsch)
    To als Präposition: to the store, to Denkmark, to my brother (manchmal ist das "zu" im Deutschen, manchmal Dativ oder eine andere Präposition)

    Und hier eine kleine Übung:

    ___ children rode their bikes ___ the store ___ buy a bag of jelly beans and ___ 6-packs of root beer ___ take home ___ their grandfather. His doctor has told him ___ drink more water because he consumes ___ much pop. Grandad refuses ___ drink water, however, preferring any other beverage ___ water, which he finds ___ bland. He would like ___ put ___ scoops of ice cream in the root beer and make a float, but that has ___ many calories.

    *editier. WK wie wild wink* Bin gerade in Iowa. Der Sommer ist angekommen, denn heute Nachmittag hörte ich zum ersten Mal diesen Sommer die Zikaden.
    #233AuthorAmy-MiMi (236989) 27 Jun 12, 04:26
    Comment
    Thanks for the explanation Amy_MiMi.
    So it might be too hot today to go out for shopping, too. (would be a correct construction and spelling?) or I cannot join you, I am too busy, too.
    Is the too (=auch) always separated by a comma?
    #234Authorwaltherwithh (554696) 27 Jun 12, 13:14
    Comment
    @waltherwithh: Vielleicht hilft diese Site. http://www.chicagomanualofstyle.org/CMS_FAQ/C...

    Ich bezweifle, dass es eine allgemeingültige Regel zu too+Komma gibt.
    #235AuthorAmy-MiMi (236989) 27 Jun 12, 14:09
    Comment
    @Amy-MiMi

    *using my eagle's eyes & gut feeling*
    I have a doubt about "die Wenigsten"

    *looking in "Duden, Richtiges und gutes Deutsch"*

    Das Indefinitum und unbestimmte Zahlwort wenig wird auch in Verbindung mit einem Artikel kleingeschrieben...die wenigen, wenige glauben...
    Klein schreibt man üblicherweise auch den Superlativ:... die wenigsten...
    Großschreibung ist möglich, wenn hervorgehoben werden soll, dass nicht das unbestimmte Zahlwort gemeint ist: "Sie freut sich über das Wenige (= die wenigen Geschenke).


    I don't think this latter case applies to your sentence, so I was right with my feeling, wasn't I?
    #236AuthorGoldammer (428405) 27 Jun 12, 16:14
    Comment
    Huuhuu. Gestern Abend war ich mit meinen Freunden wieder im All-You-Can-Eat Sushi-Restaurant. Meine Güte. Das Sushi war so gut. Ich denke, bis zur Mittagspause werde ich immer noch satt sein.

    Hallo Willi, schön, dass du nach so langer Zeit wieder vorbei schaust. Irgendwie *6g* klingelt dein Nick eine Glocke *6g*, obwohl ich damals nur OROP war.
    #237AuthorLara Chu (AmE) (236716) 27 Jun 12, 16:15
    Comment
    Goldammer must be very busy that she doesn'r offer any correcturitos.

    Aber mal im Ernst: auf die Gefahr hin, selbst alt und spießig (korrekt) rüberzukommen, würde ich eigentlich nicht sagen: Sch*** auf deine Eltern und ihre Erwartungen. Sie haben nunmal schon fast zwei Jahrzehnte für dein Wohl gearbeitet und gespart, vielleicht sogar ge(ö)opfert, und studieren ist ja auch aus anderen Gründen ratsam. Falls du schon genug Geld und Zeit hast, dir ein gap year zu nehmen, ginge das vielleicht auch -- wenn du einen guten Plan machst, was genau du damit erreichen (und hoffentlich auch dabei lernen) willst und nicht bloß ein ganzes Jahr lang, ähm, locker (aus)rumhängen und Mädchen (hinterherlaufen)besser: anbaggern würdest. Das wäre eine Verschwendung sowohl deiner Talente als auch deiner Zeit. Und wie Lara sagt, kannst du wahrscheinlich einen Weg finden, Zeit in Schweden zu verbringen, auch wenn du studierst. Und wie Gibson sagt, du bist ja auch schon im Ausland und machst schon eine schöne Auszeit, und bleibst vielleicht sogar noch ein paar Monate, oder?

    Wenn das nicht eine (keine?) zu persönliche Frage ist, weißt du schon, welches Fach du studieren wirst? (Das muss man in D eigentlich schon entschieden haben, bevor man sich immatrikuliert, nicht wahr, anders als hier?)


    Blue sky, white clouds, 24° this weather could stay for the next seven weeks (you might know, today is Siebenschläfertag).
    #238Authorbluesky (236159) 27 Jun 12, 16:40
    Comment
    I will try to answer everyone at once.

    Spelling reform: I'm born in 1992, the reform took place in 1996.
    However, everything I grew up with was still written in the pre-reform orthography, so I have my problems there as well.

    Au Pair in the UK: The idea was to have a "holiday" and improve my English and obtain the CAE at the same time.
    The CAE is an obligatory part of the qualifications for the air traffic controller job, as I didn't have any English in the last two years of school.
    After my stay here, I will first return to Germany and then travel around in Europe for one month (with the interrail ticket) and see all my dear friends again.
    Now, only four weeks are left.
    The flight has already been booked and there's no way back.

    The dilemma is that I have several options, but I can't figure out what the best way is. And the time runs.
    All my thoughts focus on this matter and my helplessness and yearning make me feel very, very sad...
    - study in Germany (same small village where nothing really happens, same faces, boredom) and apply for air traffic controller (chances are very low)
    - study in Sweden, but stay in Germany first (study in English; would give me enough time to learn Swedish properly before going there, as it is already too late to enrol for this semester)
    - go work in Sweden first and learn Swedish before studying (my Swedish is not good enough to take any jobs yet, probably not even A1)
    - do only a semester in Sweden, but study in Germany

    Swedes: Well, it is easy to get to know people from other countries - we all sit in the same boat.
    You have something like a catalogue of questions (name? origin? job? current residence?) in your mind and you just ask them to anyone.
    I guess that "fast mover" means something like "alter Charmeur" or "Draufgänger" - no, I certainly am not (I am certainly not? Adverbs confuse me).
    Probably, I am one of the shyest persons to walk upon the earth.

    Studies: My initial idea was to become teacher, but as my science skills are very poor, I would be forced to study subjects deriving from the social/linguistic spectrum.
    And at the moment, nobody seems to need those teachers, so my new subject would be something related to economy.
    #239AuthorThonatas (821337) 27 Jun 12, 17:57
    Comment
    I did not know there were universities in German villages. A lot changed since I left the country :)
    I cannot help you with your indecisiveness, but I can tell you that you can go and work in Sweden without being able to speak the language. It is more a question what type of job you are looking for and how flexible the employer is (and how flexible you are with the choice of work). I have a friend who actually worked several times in Sweden - by now she probably speaks some Swedish, but she got along quite well with just English.
    If you want to go to Sweden - always start there in summer. The winter is really dark and glum, so not a great start for a new place.
    If you want to be an air traffic controller - why not try to get into the job in several countries? You never know there might be a shortage of air traffic controllers in Heathrow :)
    #240AuthorDixie (426973) 27 Jun 12, 19:49
    Comment
    I would take almost any job actually - but there's a difference between working for your employer in a foreign branch and the actual search for a new job.
    Your friend did the former, didn't she?
    If I'm mistaken - what did she work as?
    I'm still looking for possibilities.

    The part about the village etc. was just a description of what awaits me at home if I enrol at the university in the next town :)
    #241AuthorThonatas (821337) 27 Jun 12, 21:45
    Comment
    Isn't enrolment time nearly over? (I can hear Goldammer tell me again that I am completely out of sync :))
    My friend is a telecommunications engineer and she worked for a Swedish company, but my main point was that you can go there, live there and work there without knowing the language. Moving within a large company can be easier - but it can also be very difficult. My current company does not support it at all. You can also find a job by just going there and looking around. It does takes a lot of determination, though. Most of my jobs abroad where found simply by looking around.
    #242AuthorDixie (426973) 27 Jun 12, 22:16
    Comment
    Somehow I've always imagined shy people as somewhat less forceful in their opinion ;))

    hm, as higher education in Germany is free (used to be free, I should say, and now requires a token amount in some states) parents don't normally 'work and save for twenty years' to send their offspring to university. Some parents help their kids with living expenses, but if they are too poor for that, the students get a loan from the state. I don't know anybody whose parents put away (tens of) thousands of euros to pay for college. (I don't mean to say that therefore they have no right to take an interest in their children's career, it's more a general comment about our education system.)
    #243AuthorGibson (418762) 27 Jun 12, 22:21
    Comment
    Wie bitte? Kann es sein, dass ich über $200,000 ausgegeben habe, um meinen Sohn beim Bachelor zu unterstützen, und es bei Euch ein bisschen billiger wäre? :-(
    #244AuthorJurist (US) (804041) 27 Jun 12, 23:03
    Comment
    In Sweden, higher education is completely for free - the same applies for Germany, but only in some federal lands.
    That's one of the major weaknesses of the US educational system, I think.
    Same for the health system.
    #245AuthorThonatas (821337) 27 Jun 12, 23:32
    Comment
    In Austria public university education was again free of charge this summer semester, as the parties concerned didn't manage to find an agreement regarding fees. Prior to that it was close to euro 300 per semester (i.e., just under 600 per year).

    There are a few private universities, mainly catering for specific needs like religious studies. Obviously there charges are much higher.

    Thonatas: Don't believe anyone who tells you that teachers aren't needed or won't be recruited. They never get their forecasts right. In Germany, as well as in Austria, a large number of teachers are due for retirement. There will be a huge need for all kinds of teachers shortly (i.e., starting around 2015).
    #246Authorleo029 (14476) 28 Jun 12, 00:05
    Comment
    Sozialismus pur, Jurist. Würde die Tea Party wenigstens sagen. Bist du nicht dankbar, dass wir hier keinen haben? \-;

    Aber wenn es dich tröstet, glaube ich, dass man an einer guten US-Universität vielleicht immer noch eine bessere Allgemeinbildung bekommt, oder wenigstens bekommen kann. (Jetzt schlagen mich alle Europäer, die sich früher spezialisiert und es auch gut gefunden haben ...)

    Thonatas, ich glaube zu verstehen, warum du am liebsten nicht bloß ein beliebiges Fach an der örtlichen Universität studieren möchtest, aber ist Lehrer wirklich das Einzige außer Fluglotse, das dich interessiert? Und warum ausdrücklich Fluglotse -- ist das nicht unglaublich stressig und erfordert es nicht wenigstens viel Mathe und andere technischen Kenntnisse? Wenn du lieber Sprachen und dich mit Leuten zu unterhalten magst, auch wenn du nicht gerade extravertiert bist (sorry übrigens, aber hier kommst du nicht besonders schüchtern vor (-: ), könnte es sogar gerade das Falsche für dich sein, immer höchstkonzentriert vor einem Bildschirm zu sitzen und mit praktisch niemandem zu sprechen.

    Wie wäre es mit etwas in der Reise- und Hotelindustrie? Oder wenn du in Schweden studieren würdest, welches Fach wird dort besonders gut unterrichtet, für welche sind die Unis dort am besten bekannt? Ich würde nicht unbedingt das Land vor der Uni auswählen, oder bist du schon so sicher, dass du wirklich permanent nach Schweden umziehen möchtest?

    #247Authorhm -- us (236141) 28 Jun 12, 00:38
    Comment
    I think, hm, the European view is that we get our general education in school and not at university :). But I agree with you to a certain degree - you can get a very good education at univerity or college. I also think that - although I find the fees too high - they create a much higher incentive for the students to concentrate on their studies and finish within the given time.
    I also think that kids in the US are more decisive in what they want to do - they think about their plans earlier and prepare accordingly. (Last Sunday I had a conversation with a mother of a 17-year-old and I was impressed on all their planning).
    (I knew a few people who finished their studies, started out as translators and started a new course at university just to get cheap health insurance and bus tickets)
    And a few corrections (without any stray umlauts :)):
    Jetzt schlagen mich alle Europäer, die sich früh spezialisiert haben und es auch gut fanden ...)

    Und warum gerade/ausgerechnetFluglotse (I am not sure what exactly you wanted to say with "ausdrücklich", but your sentence hints towards "gerade/ausgerechnet")
    extrovertiert bist (sorry übrigens, aber hier kommst du mir nicht besonders schüchtern vor (-:
    #248AuthorDixie (426973) 28 Jun 12, 01:07
    Comment
    Ja, 'ausgerechnet' war genau das, was sagen wollte. Vielen Dank fürs Gedankenlesen.

    Und ausgerechnet bei 'vorkommen' mache ich schon den zweiten strohdummen Fehler im selben Faden. Aargh. Nicht mein Tag. (Aber immerhin ein Beitrag ohne Umlautfehler, danke.)

    So weit ich es verstanden habe, war extravertiert Jungs ursprüngliche Schreibweise, wegen der Präposition auf Latein. Aber manche Wörterbücher erkennen es tatsächlich nicht.

    Ob Studenten in den USA sich besser konzentrieren, neige ich irgendwie zu bezweifeln, aber sobald sie anfangen, die Kredite zurückzuzahlen, gibt das ihnen sicher zu denken. (Steht im WB zu 'concentrates the mind'?)

    Ich merke etwas verspätet, dass ich es versäumt habe, willi winzig zu grüßen. Immer schön, wenn alte Gesichter nicht nur in neuen Nicks auftauchen, aber auch Bescheid geben, damit wir nicht grübeln müssen, wieso jemand so bekannt wirkt. (-:

    Auch schön, dass es WK immer noch gibt.
    #249Authorhm -- us (236141) 28 Jun 12, 02:49
    Comment
    I would have expected that the idea of having a huge loan makes it less likely to be a "Bummelstudent".
    I have to say, hm, I really like your Umlautfehler, you always put them in places I would never have thought of. (no offence meant here)
    #250AuthorDixie (426973) 28 Jun 12, 03:01
    Comment
    Just found this article about languages in the classroom on the ORF website
    http://www.orf.at/stories/2125694/2125617/
    and since it goes very well with a discussion we had here a few days ago I thought it might be of interest even if it is about the specific situation in Austria. But things are not so different elsewehere, I guess.
    #251AuthorSachs (638558) 28 Jun 12, 10:14
    Comment
    I just paid 108 euros at my local vet because the dog slipped when she was walking along a tree trunk and fell off (and I laughed, shame on me. But it did look funny.). Aren't dogs and cats supposed to be graceful and agile and things??
    #252AuthorGibson (418762) 28 Jun 12, 18:40
    Comment
    How old is the dog?

    To answer your question:
    graceful: yes
    agile: yes
    things: Hmm, some people will argue that animals are things, but I don't agree. ;-)
    #253Authorharambee (91833) 28 Jun 12, 19:07
    Comment
    She certainly was a pretty young thing when we got her. ;)

    Now, though, she's getting quite elderly and too old for shenaningans on trees. But I don't think she knows that.
    #254AuthorGibson (418762) 28 Jun 12, 19:52
    Comment
    I wouldn't say that dogs are graceful - cats are (and I don't like cats).

    @hm -- us:
    One may not confuse the internet with the real world.
    It's easy to write lively, as you have enough time to think about what you will write and which words you will use.
    Also, the anonymity acts like a safe shelter.
    In real life, I tend to express my opinion in just a few words and very often, conversations end up in awkward silence, because I don't know what to say or because I take note of what my dialogue partner says, but don't see the need to answer.

    I think I will do it.
    Go to Sweden and study something in English.
    There are various interesting bachelor courses (http://www.studyinsweden.se/Course-search/) - the ones in the "business & social sciences" are the most interesting ones.
    They all require the CAE, but that shouldn't be the problem.
    It will allow me to study Swedish, improve my English and fulfill my "duty" (university studies) at the same time.
    Also, I think that studying in a foreign country - especially in English - will certainly improve my chances to get a good job.

    Here's the Times' university ranking:
    http://www.timeshighereducation.co.uk/world-u...
    As you can see, the top 14 places are all super-expensive universities based in the USA or the UK - they can afford specialists and the most up-to-date technologies and research facilities.

    The university I would have studied at (Würzburg) is somewhere between rank 201 and 225, so I can easily find a Swedish university which is as good as or even better than the university of Würzburg.

    The job as air traffic controller requires mostly English, mental arithmetic and spatial sense.
    It is a stressful and very responsible job, yes, but the effort is rewarded with a very high salary.
    The chances to get the job are minimal; 400 jobs, 5000 applicants.
    And I dare to say that I will most certainly not get the job.
    #255AuthorThonatas (821337) 28 Jun 12, 19:57
    Comment
    I had a cat before I moved to my current flat and I'm probably more of the cat type, but I like dogs as well and I met many dogs who liked me :-)

    I'm surprised how important rankings of universities have become, but that's how it is. It seems that living expenses in Sweden are only slightly higher than in Germany. Furthermore, students from EU countries don't have to pay tuition fees, so Sweden sounds like a possible alternative.
    #256Authorharambee (91833) 28 Jun 12, 20:24
    Comment
    woot! 51st in the world. what whaaaat ;o)
    #257AuthorLara Chu (AmE) (236716) 28 Jun 12, 20:30
    Comment
    Anyone for tennis?
    #258AuthorEmil 14 (299747) 28 Jun 12, 21:23
    Comment
    And Germany is out of the tournament in Poland/Ukraine after a weak match against more clever Italians.
    I can think in the plane which team I might "support" on Sunday.
    #259Authorwaltherwithh (554696) 28 Jun 12, 23:04
    Comment
    They do indeed earn a lot of money, considering the hours they work, it seems.
    But then - I would not base my job decision on the salary.
    If you are going back next month, when will you start studying? Or is that another year out?
    The university ranking is interesting - the Times likes those lists. (and I miss them)
    #260AuthorDixie (426973) 28 Jun 12, 23:30
    Comment
    I've been to the information day on the campus of the Deutsche Flugsicherung in Langen (near Frankfort) and it was a great experience; I also think that analytic thinking is one of my strengths.
    #261AuthorThonatas (821337) 29 Jun 12, 00:18
    Comment
    Well, I applied for a job at Lufthansa in 1968, they told the group of app. 15 at that time after the interviews and tests that there were about 4.000 applicants per year, 400 made it to Cologne, and 25 were finally hired.
    A friend of me joined after his army services EUROCONTROL and he said it was pure stress, they make money but usually retire early. And I think it is getting worse.

    I like cats and dogs (not when pouring) but admire the independency of cats.
    #262Authorwaltherwithh (554696) 29 Jun 12, 00:57
    Comment
    I, too, like cats and dogs, and horses, and donkeys (as long as they're four-legged), and almost all sorts of mammals - not necessarily all of them in my living room, but I love to watch them.

    I can't imagine that flight controller turns out to be a dream job. I sometimes watch a series called "Mayday", reporting about real aircraft accidents and what caused them. They also show the air controllers time and again, and it really looks like an awfully stressful job with a tremendous responsibility. Doesn't change the fact that there have to be people who do the job. I just doubt if it is the right job for someone who decides to describe himself as rather shy and sometimes lost for words. I guess you have to be very quick and flexible when you have to deal with all the people involved in the starting and landing process, several aircrofts practically at the same time etc.
    #263AuthorSachs (638558) 29 Jun 12, 01:37
    Comment

    Thanks for the welcome everybody. It's nice to see that there are still some of you around from the "old times".

    @Goldammer: ... but I do remember _you_. However, it turned out that we logged in at very different times of the day, so that perhaps we didn't take part in the same conversation very often.

    @Walther: As to Heinz Erhard: I used to be fond of his poems and movies, at least when I was a teenager. Meanwhile I can't really make sense of that any more ... Anyway, I don't completely remember why I took that nick back then, but now I thought it might make sense to reuse it. When we had a LEO meeting in Frankfurt and I identified as WW, somebody expressed he would have expected something more in line with the visual appearance of Erhard, in particular in terms of girth ... I had to let him down.

    @Amy: Yes, it's a pity I can't use my old account any more. But I can confirm that it's me! (But then, who couldn't ...)

    @Wachtelkönig: That's right, I started CC threads in the Spanish and Russian fora. You'll be surprise, but one of my first activities here was to look for the Spanish CC. I had lost track of it rather soon. Is it true that it was called "Cuatro Gatos" all the time?

    @LaraChu: I'm sorry, could you please explain to me what OROP means? (As to the ringing bell, I wouldn't use that phrase in German. I suppose the standard expression would be "X kommt mir bekannt vor." Sounds rather dull compared to the English wording, but I'm afraid there's no such catchy phrase for it.)

    About my life? Well, a lot of happened, obviously, in a few years, but nothing that spectacular. The most crucial aspect at the moment for me is that I'll expect to be a father for the first time in a couple of months ...
    #264AuthorWilli W. Winzig (872591) 29 Jun 12, 06:26
    Comment
    @Willi: OROP = occasional read-only participant
    "Ring a bell" war nur scherzhaft verwendet :o)

    TGIF!
    #265AuthorLara Chu (AmE) (236716) 29 Jun 12, 15:03
    Comment
    Huhu everyone on the left and the right side of the pond !
    *wavingateveryonearound*

    Just a quick drop-by to bring back an errant foundling : related discussion: fast mover

    *wavinggoodby*
    #266Authorno me bré (700807) 29 Jun 12, 19:13
    Comment
    On a day like this ('Ein Tag zum Helden zeugen') fast movers do, what is expected of them: they move fast and leave online pastimes to slow movers ..
    #267Authorleo029 (14476) 30 Jun 12, 15:10
    Comment
    @Lara: Ah, you mean a lurker. ;-)
    #268AuthorWilli W. Winzig (872591) 30 Jun 12, 23:52
    Comment
    Inzwischen sind wir wieder schneckenhaft geworden, keine fast movers. Falls keiner bis Morgen Lust hat, könnte ich ein neues Zimmerchen basteln.

    @Sachs: Du magst fast alle Saugetiere, nur nicht im Haus? LEO sagt mir, dass ein donkey ein Hausesel ist, also hast du bestimmt nichts gegen ein Esel, solange es nicht im Wohnzimmer ist.

    Korrektürchen für waltherwithh: a friend of me mine...

    Türchen für Sachs #263: an awfully stressful job with a responsibility... Wenn man generell viel Verantwortung trägt, dann responsibility ohne Artikel. Wenn man das näher präzisiert, dann mit Artikel: Max is responsible for feeding the house donkey. The responsibility is all his because Sachs doesn't appreciate donkeys in the living room. Und dann ein falscher Freund: to deal with all the people involved in the starting take-off and landing process..Und dann ein Tippfehler: several aircraft...Craft hat keine Pluralform.

    Am Freitag waren meine Schwägerin, mein Mann und ich beim Horse Progress Days in Clare, Michigan. Ganz interessant, wenn man wissen möchte, welche neuen Arbeitsgeräte es gibt, für den Landwirt, der keinen Trecker benutzt, sondern mit Pferden arbeitet. Die Zuschauer, Teilnehmer, Verkäufer und so waren ungefähr 90 Amische. Ein interessantes interkulterelles Erlebnis für mich als "Englische" (so nennen die Amischen die Amerikaner, die nicht amisch und deshalb nicht deutschsprachig sind). Hier ein Link mit Fotos von 2010: http://horseprogressdays.com/photo-gallery.asp

    Hier sind Fotos von 2010.
    #269AuthorAmy-MiMi (236989) 01 Jul 12, 02:41
    Comment
    So, who maintains the web presence for the horse progress days? It can't be the Amish, right?
    And - are there many Irish in Clare? :)
    And a doorlet: "nichts gegen einen Esel" (it's "der Esel", easy to remember with "ich der Esel geh voran ... :))
    #270AuthorDixie (426973) 01 Jul 12, 05:08
    Comment
    Not so easy for Amy *hihi*
    She has to replace ich by du ;-)

    *wavingaroundandgreetingeverybody*
    #271Authormanni3 (305129) 01 Jul 12, 07:35
    Comment
    My apologies to Amy, the sentence was not meant to offend her in any way - it is the sentence I was taught to remember that "ich" is always the last in an enumeration.
    #272AuthorDixie (426973) 01 Jul 12, 16:41
    Comment
    Amy, if you still want to "bashtel", go ahead!

    Today I bought the new issue of "National Geographic Kids" (want to send the article on penguins to one of my sponsored kids in Nairobi) and I learned about coyotes living in urban Chicago and in other towns. That was a surprise to me; I had expected them in more rural areas.

    From the news I also learned that Mexico is holding elections today. Is that a topic in American news? The result may effect the US?! It seems the situation in Mexico has deteriorated in recent years. The drug wars are really terrible and nobody seems to have a solution.
    #273Authorharambee (91833) 01 Jul 12, 17:04
    Comment
    The drug wars are really terrible and nobody seems to have a solution.

    Oh that's easy. Make the drugs legal.
    #274Authorbluesky (236159) 01 Jul 12, 18:16
    Comment
    You mean the US should legalize drugs to ease the situation in Mexico?
    #275Authorharambee (91833) 01 Jul 12, 18:26
    Comment
    Maybe they should try. For decades, every state on earth has tried everything else, with very little success. It can't get much worse, can it? Maybe we'd be surprised.
    #276AuthorGibson (418762) 01 Jul 12, 18:30
    Comment
    >>Mexico is holding elections today. Is that a topic in American news?

    Ja, aber nur sehr bedingt, zumal die Wahl anscheinend nicht sehr kompetitiv wird.

    —> The result may [effect] affect the US

    Was den Krieg gegen Drogen betrifft, stimmt es zwar, dass niemand eine einfache Lösung hat, aber einige Länder haben erfolgreicher dagegen gekämpft als andere. Kolumbien z.B. hat die Situation immer noch nicht im Griff, ist aber nach Jahrzehnten wenigstens etwas näher an Normalität. *auf Holz klopf*

    Ich wäre auch dankbar, wenn Amy oder jemand Zeit und Lust zu basteln hätte.
    #277Authorhm -- us (236141) 01 Jul 12, 19:12
    Comment
    Sure. And not only Mexico.
    #278Authorbluesky (236159) 01 Jul 12, 19:31
    Comment
    I understand the idea, bluesky, although I'm not convinced that that would solve all problems. And in any case that is nothing a Mexican government can do. And the drug cartels would probably try to kill all politicians who want to legalize the drugs.
    #279Authorharambee (91833) 01 Jul 12, 19:36
    Comment
    Die Highlights könnten übrigens ruhig etwas kurzer sein, oder meinetwegen ganz weg falls nötig/hilfreich. Tut mir leid, ich wollte im (vor?)letzten Faden keinen schlechten Präzedenzfall schaffen und alle denken lassen, sie müssten alles beschreiben.
    #280Authorhm -- us (236141) 01 Jul 12, 23:34
    Comment
    Good evening!

    Wanted to respond to Willi Winzig:
    It was called the Casa de los cuatro gatos (Cuatro gatos = little folks without importance according to the DICCIONARIO DE LA LENGUA ESPAÑOLA). We went through four of them, finishing with a weirdly named WG de los Gatos. Numerous participants unfortunately disappeared. Hope they are all doing well, especially the Mexicans.

    And I basically agree with bluesky. The Colombian coca production and the exportation via Mexico should be legal, administrated by local producers and decent transportation outfits, and not by atrociously criminal entities, who simply kill everyone and swallow all the money.

    Good night!
    #281AuthorWachtelkönig (396690) 02 Jul 12, 05:18
    Comment
    @willi winzig
    Oh really, you do remember me? And as "Goldammer" on top of it? (I changed my nick at some point)

    (6 gear) Alzheimer lets greet! (6-gear/off)
    Sorry about that!
    #282AuthorGoldammer (428405) 02 Jul 12, 11:51
    Comment
    @ #280:
    Hmm, I don't like the idea of being told, if indirectly, that I followed the wrong model when opening this thread. In fact, I had an idea how to do it, and I did it. Every OP snail should be free to shape the new house after his/her/its fancy.
    On the other hand, readers are free to skip postings, if they don't have the time to read long texts, or simply ignore them for whatever reasons.
    #283AuthorEmil 14 (299747) 02 Jul 12, 13:53
    Comment
    What are you all talking about? ;-) Emil, I don't think that hm wanted to critizise you and I can't see why you perceive her posting in that way.

    Most - if not all - of us like the variety of the introductions. We had long and short introductions in the past and I can't recall any complaints nor do I remember that I was disappointed in any case. Of course it is nice if somebody takes the time to translate a new idea into practice - and we had many very nice examples, this thread is one of them. So, such diligence is very much appreciated. It is, however, most important that we get a new thread when the old one approaches posting 300. We had very short introductions for "emergency" threads in the past and the bashtlers were rightfully praised for that. I'm a bit busy at the moment but if there is no new CC in the late afternoon I will create one with a very short introduction.
    #284Authorharambee (91833) 02 Jul 12, 14:11
    Comment
    *catching hm with her next Umlaut-mistake* ;-)

    Die Highlights könnten übrigens ruhig etwas (kurzer) kürzer sein..

    I agree with harambee that hm's posting didn't mean that you should have made shorter highlights, Emil.

    IMO she simply wanted to say: if necessary or helpful (for example for someone who hasn't got the time, Muße and creative energy to compose wonderful long highlights like yours in this thread), the bashtler can open a short-highlighted thread without having to fear anybody's criticism for it.

    #285AuthorGoldammer (428405) 02 Jul 12, 14:25
    Comment
    Ich bastele.
    #286AuthorAmy-MiMi (236989) 02 Jul 12, 14:59
    Comment
    #287AuthorAmy-MiMi (236989) 02 Jul 12, 15:29
    Comment
    Die Highlights könnten übrigens ruhig etwas kurzer sein, ...

    I perceived this as a wish or recommendation.
    I probably should have given hm -- us the benefit of the doubt.
    I am sorry once again.

    This is my version:
    Die Highlights können auch ruhig etwas kurzer sein, ...
    #288AuthorEmil 14 (299747) 02 Jul 12, 17:39
    Comment
    Ok, now I understand why you perceived hm's posting in that way. Formally, you are right, but the context has made it absolutely clear to me that hm had not meant that.
    #289Authorharambee (91833) 02 Jul 12, 17:42
    Comment
    Thanks for highlighting (SCNR) the difference between können und könnten, Emil. Der Unterschied ist für uns Nichtmuttersprachler vielleicht schwer rauszuhören.

    Korrektürchen für harambee: Formally you are right, but the context has made it absolutely clear to me that hm did not mean  had not meant that.

    related discussion: Crossover Chat 290
    #290AuthorAmy-MiMi (236989) 02 Jul 12, 21:46
    Comment
    I don't really see any difference between 'können' und 'könnten' here and I'm very surprised that Emil misunderstood hm so much. Neither of the German versions would have made me interpret her comment as criticism.
    #291AuthorGibson (418762) 02 Jul 12, 21:50
     
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