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    Translation correct?

    Erisapfel - Golden Apple of Discord

    Source Language Term

    Erisapfel

    Correct?

    Golden Apple of Discord

    Examples/ definitions with source references

    Die Krim: Der Erisapfel im Schwarzen Meer


    The Golden Apple of Discord was a golden apple dropped by Eris, the goddess of strife, at the wedding of Peleus and Thetis in the Greek myth.

    Comment

    The Golden Apple of Discord is subject of a quarrel:


    Eris, a Greek goddess known for causing trouble, was furious she didn't receive an invitation to Peleus and Thetis' wedding. To stir up chaos, she threw a golden apple into the party that read "For the most beautiful one" - or "Kallisti" in Greek. This caused the goddesses Athena, Hera, and Aphrodite to argue over who deserved the apple, until they asked Paris, the prince of Troy, to decide who should get it. Aphrodite enticed Paris with Helen, who was stunning but already wedded. Paris fell for the trick, and thus began the Trojan War.

    AuthorBubo bubo (830116) 15 Sep 23, 09:11
    Comment

    Im Deutschen eher Zankapfel (auch wenn DWDS beides kennt).

    #1Authormbshu (874725) 15 Sep 23, 09:12
    Comment

    Ja, der "Zankapfel" ist im Deutschen ziemlich bekannt, und wer sich in griechischer Mythologie auskennt, weiß auch, dass Eris den geworfen hat und das letztendlich zum Trojanischen Krieg geführt hat ...


    Mit den Bezeichungen "Erisapfel" oder gar "(goldener) Apfel der Zwietracht" dürften die Wenigsten (Anwesende ausgeschlossen) etwas anfangen können, zumindest nicht ohne Erwähnung des mythologischen Hintergrunds ...


    ... dazu auch dieser Häufigkeitsvergleich von G. Ngrams : https://books.google.com/ngrams/graph?content... ...

    #2Authorno me bré (700807)  15 Sep 23, 09:31
    Comment

    Regarding the English term, I think people usually shorten to "an apple of discord" (not capitalized) when they mean a cause of discord, rancor, a quarrel etc. When speaking of the apple of discord (from Greek mythology), I guess people would be more likely to put the "golden" in and capitalize.


    #3AuthorAE procrastinator (1268904)  16 Sep 23, 10:11
    Comment

    OT: von einem "Erisapfel" zu reden statt einem "Zankapfel" erfordert schon ein gehörig Maß an Zutrauen, dass die Leser sich in der griechischen Mythologie auskennen. Der Autor scheint hier mit seiner eigenen Kenntnis angeben zu wollen, und vergisst dabei, dass solche Artikel an den Leser gerichtet sind.


    Ich persönlich halte mich für kenntnisreicher bezüglich der griechischen Mythologie als der Durchschnittsdeutsche, könnte ohne Kontext mit "Eris" aber wenig anfangen. Hätte man mich gefragt, wer den Apfel ins Spiel gebracht hätte, hätte ich auf "Discordia" getippt (und läge dabei nur insofern falsch, dass das das römische Pantheon ist). "Erisapfel" habe ich nur deshalb richtig interpretiert, weil es nicht der Adamsapfel sein konnte, und Herkules seinen goldenen Apfel von den Hesperiden geklaut hat, nicht von Eris.


    #4Authorm.dietz (780138) 18 Sep 23, 09:27
    Comment

    #4 +1

    #5AuthorAchim Almschreck (1359109) 18 Sep 23, 11:32
    Comment

    "an apple of discord" ="a cause of discord, rancor, a quarrel etc." is not amongst the terms I am familiar with as an average joe, a grounding in classical mythology may be a relative rarity these days.


    Perhaps those old or widely-read enough may recall The Golden Apple and Discordia from the Illuminatus! trilogy by Wilson & O'Shea back in the 70s. A pulpy mishmash of legends and conspiracy theories that could perhaps have influenced Dan Brown's work.

    #6AuthorKnickerless (1325517) 19 Sep 23, 11:28
    Comment

    re #6 - I thought Rick Riordan had given a couple decades worth of teens, if not a thorough grounding, at least a nodding acquaintance with many stories from Greek mythology by now. No idea as to whether the apple comes up in there, though.

    In relation to the Judgement of Paris, it is often simply called the Golden Apple, but I agree that it doesn't get mentioned much outside of literary circles, other than in miniseries about the Trojan War. Sounds like Zankapfel may have wider currency.


    #7AuthorAE procrastinator (1268904) 21 Sep 23, 08:29
    Comment

    "bone of contention" is to "apple of discord" roughly what Zankapfel is to Erisapfel.


    A couple more Ngram graphs (fwtw):

    bone of contention / apple of discord

    Zankapfel / Erisapfel

    #8AuthorBion (1092007) 21 Sep 23, 09:20
    Comment

    Still OT

    Yes, that sounds right. Though, I suspect there are contexts where one term would work and the other would not (in addition, of course, to those in which one specifically intended to allude to the judgement of Paris).

    For instance, I've heard or read "sowing the apple of discord" (I always wanted a reference to the seeds, somehow, but it sounds better than "sowing a bone"). I think a bone of contention isn't a bone of contention until its been contended over for quite a while.

    You could toss either the apple of discord or a bone of contention into a situation, but you wouldn't always be doing the same thing, would you?

    Maybe you could marinate or stew up or preseason a bone of contention ; )

    #9AuthorAE procrastinator (1268904)  21 Sep 23, 09:59
    Comment

    Indeed, indeed, and the Evening Star and the Morning Star refer to the same planet, but aren't interchangeable. ;-)

    #10AuthorBion (1092007) 21 Sep 23, 10:07
    Comment

    "Sowing a bone" drängt bei mir eher das Bild auf, dass Knochen eingegraben werden, damit aus denen dann über Nacht eine Armee von Knochenkriegern entsteht. Das Sprachbild existiert im Deutschen dann eher als "Drachenzähne säen", kommt aber ebenso aus der griechische Mythologie (wenn ich mich recht erinnere aus Iasons Suche nach dem goldenen Vlies), kann man also als ebenso bekannt oder unbekannt ansehen, wie den Zankapfel.

    #11Authorm.dietz (780138)  21 Sep 23, 10:20
    Comment

    Re #11 Gosh, yes! Sowing dragon's teeth. That is almost certainly also limited to literary circles in English.

    Regarding the first image you mentioned- "sowing a bone" made me think of "sowing skulls and bones". I couldn't think why, but google knew: "History Lesson" by the Okanagan Canadian poet Jeannette Armstrong- "farmers sowing skulls and bones and miners pulling from gaping holes green paper faces of a smiling English lady".

    #12AuthorAE procrastinator (1268904) 21 Sep 23, 10:39
    Comment

    Das versteht jeder:


    Die Krim: Juwel und Zankapfel

    Die Krim ist von Hand zu Hand gegangen, von Skythen zu Griechen und Römern, Goten und Hunnen, Mongolen und Tataren. 

    https://www.nationalgeographic.de/geschichte-...

    #13Authorzacki (1263445) 26 Sep 23, 09:04
     
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